Have you heard of this prophetic hadith?

Discussion in 'Islam' started by Amica, May 27, 2016.

  1. SufiPhilosophy

    SufiPhilosophy Evolution by mutation has never been observed

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    The Rapture was apparently an Islamic hadith that got adopted by Christians, it didn't exist in Christianity pre-Islam?

    The Last Day is very far away.

    The Antichrist is a major sign but by no means the last. After the Antichrist there will be Gog and Magog, the Rapture, and then Satan himself taking physical form, and then Israfel blasting the trumpet.

    The main thing is though, the Antichrist will appear at a time when nobody is thinking about him. Yet everybody talks about him these days in youtube vids about the end times, in fact he's the main focus of islamic eschatology. I imagine we've quite a loooong time before the End Times when we forget the antichrist is even due, which is both good news and bad news because it means we've a long way to fall yet!
     
  2. Thomas

    Thomas Administrator Admin

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    Not sure about that.

    Usually it's regarded as a phenomenon among some American Evangelicals, it seems to have risen in the 18th century along with various movements, but from what I've seen, there's no reference to Islam as a source or contributor to the doctrine. As it sems to me to be the province of right-wing fundamentalists (I could be wrong), I'd be cautious about claiming its adoption or even a discreet influence on Christians, that kind of thing doesn't go down too well with that kind of person! :D

    Of course, if you have evidence to the contrary, I'd welcome it.
     
  3. SufiPhilosophy

    SufiPhilosophy Evolution by mutation has never been observed

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    OK well open google:

    "These stages are mentioned in detail in the hadeeth narrated by Muslim (2940) from ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Amr (may Allaah be pleased with him), who said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:


    “The Dajjaal will appear among my ummah and he will stay for forty.


    Then Allaah will send ‘Eesa ibn Maryam, who looks like ‘Urwah ibn Mas’ood, and he will pursue him and kill him.


    Then the people will remain for seven years with no enmity between any two people.



    Then Allaah will send a cool wind from the direction of Syria and there will be no one left on the face of the earth in whose heart there is an atom’s weight of goodness or faith but it will cause him to die. Even if one of you were to enter the heart of a mountain, it would enter upon him and cause him to die.” He said: I heard it from the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), who said:


    “There will be left the most evil of people who will be as careless as birds and be as cruel as wild animals. They will not acknowledge any good or denounce any evil.


    Then the Shaytaan will appear to them and will say: Will you not listen to me? They will say: What do you command us to do? He will command them to worship idols, but despite that they will have ample provision and a good life.


    Then the Trumpet will be blown.” "




    Also note some Americans have borrowed from Islam for their cults e.g.

    Mormon - the Scrolls of Abraham : a scripture hitherto only mentioned in the Qur'an, not even mentioned in the Bible. Recently also found in the original D.S.S. library as discovered / deposited by wily new fangled school of archaeology

    KKK also have the Kloran! But it's probably not worth the read except to pass time on a journey where ur sat next to a Klansman.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2021
  4. Thomas

    Thomas Administrator Admin

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    I think this comes under 'causal fallacy'?
    Can you evidence any direct attribution of the doctrine to a foundation Islamic text?

    OK, that shows it happens, but did it happen in the case of the theology of the Rapture?

    I am offended on your behalf! :D
     
  5. SufiPhilosophy

    SufiPhilosophy Evolution by mutation has never been observed

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    You latest fallacies: False Authority (it don't matter whether the right wing Xtians like Islam or not, they still borrowed this concept from it) and Moving the Goalposts (it's pretty obvious they did and if it were you making the argument or any other argument, you wouldn't be so dismissive).


    To call out a logical fallacy requires the use of basic reason because logic deals with absolutes and logical fallacies rely on logic and reason.
    You can call a car hitting a lampost a causal fallacy because even 1 nanosecond before impact there are a quadzillion other things that could have caused the lampost to bend and the car was clearly nowhere near the lampost at that point in time.

    However, if you used reason - which you ditch at will, but is your duty as an adult to uphold - then obviously there were no other well known instances of rapture that could be attributed as a source and as the information age began with the Italian Renaissance and the melding of east and west, or briefly also before then in ancient times with Alexander's conquests, the rapture it could easily be attributed to Islam, especially considering America's great melting pot cities and libraries and academic institutions and antiquarian societies.

    Moreover there's precedent with the examples l cited, which you ignored, hence Argument from Omission logical fallacy.

    Then you patronise me by the remark about being offended on my behalf, exaggerating the situation on my behalf in absence of my showing any such emotion. I would normally take this amiably, but:

    You consistently use logical fallacies when discussing Islam
    You have launched some rather personal attacks on the founder and close companions of our religion, even if you were citing an orientalist source in doing so
    You are trolling because you repeat negative assertions without integrating feedback - you dimiss the feedback as a logical fallacy on the basis there could have been other causes and thus you offhandedly ignore the evidence l gave and don't even acknowledge the strength of it.

    You then tell me l must accept that the forum is open to all faiths and we must be tolerant. Evidently not when it comes to dictating Muslims' beliefs to them on the Islamic subforum.

    Sure you can attack Islamic beliefs - l'd love that - as long as you do so using logic, reason - don't forget reason - and you integrate feedback into your responses.
    You assume Islam is flawed and therefore the continued successful defence of it on here must be elastic trickery of some sort and therefore we must be intolerant and forcing our beliefs on you otherwise why would we be so special that we can answer back every criticism? We must be trolling you or something right? We must be doing a causal fallacy and trolling and being unfair to you, right? Not that we just have a very nice clean defensible religion that just will not fall. That's why l love hearing critique of my religion, because it never falls to these attacks. I don't take the slightest bit of offence.

    What is offensive is your trolling. Anybody can check previous posts to see that your moderators dish out warnings to me and passive aggressive threats to shut down debates, although l'll admit on one occasion, l did get the OP's message wrong.

    Even to the extent that you try to shoo me away from posting on your science subforum, disproving evolution, because as you say, this isn't a science forum. L O L !!!!


    Bye bye Thomas, peace :)
     
  6. Thomas

    Thomas Administrator Admin

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    Bye bye
     

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