I believe

Discussion in 'Belief and Spirituality' started by wil, Oct 12, 2020.

  1. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    I believe in the prophethood of Muhammad as the last messenger of Allah, you may call me Muslim. I believe in the resurrection of Jesus and the virgin birth, you may call me Christian. I believe in the words of the Prophet Moses, you may call me a Jew. I believe in the love practised by Guru Nanak, you may call me Sikh. I believe in the eternal shakti of Bhagavan, you may call me Hindu. I believe in the love preached by his Holiness, you may call me Ahmadi. I believe in the practices of Buddha, you may call me Buddhist. I believe in the progeny of the Prophet and I cry for Hussain, I am a Shia. I revere the Sahaba, I am a Sunni. You want to categorise my beliefs but I won't be caged. Allah created me out of love. Therefore, duty-bound, I shall pay respect to all religions that practice and teach humanity as that is the religion which I believe my God wanted to establish on earth indefinitely.

    Fatima Raza
     
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  2. Craz

    Craz Active Member

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    Nice.
    This reminds of a quote by Kabir, who when asked what his religion is, answered, "My religion is the religion that existed before there was any religion".
     
  3. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls Staff Member

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    Sounds to me like she is a Bahai ;)

    I wouldn't go QUITE as far as that, but I definitely call myself a Christian.
    Some Christians ask me "How is that? Do you believe that Jesus is the son of God?".

    My reply is "No, but not ALL Christians believe that, you know!" :)

    eg. Unitarians .. including Isaac Newton (Mathematician), Florence Nightingale (Humanitarian),
    and the 27th. President of the US, William Howard Taft (1909-1913)
     
  4. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Admirable sentiment, and reflective of the contemporary liberal zeitgeist.

    But, if I were to play devil's advocate for a moment, I would point out that the sacra doctrina on which those religions are founded, by and large, it is reverence of the God in question that the God in question wanted to establish on earth, and then, and subsequently, the message of social justice.

    Not the other way round.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  5. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    What is the objection?

    Honoring all religions?

    Suggesting you refer to them by one or more?

    Claiming they are one or more?

    Or finding value in each?
     
  6. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls Staff Member

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    I would say that any objection of a believer in "the Abrahamic God" would most likely
    be based on their evaluation of a particular religion..

    eg. Is it monotheistic? What is the origin of its authority? Do people worship idols? and so on

    Most of the religions mentioned in the OP are not a major problem, as they have ROOTS that most likely
    are offshoots of Divinely inspired faith.
    eg. sikhism founded by Guru Nanak - based on Islam / Hindusm

    Disrespecting others due to their religion only causes division and maybe violence.
    That is why it's important to seek knowledge, and avoid the trap of arrogantly thinking you are right etc.
    [ not necessarily easy .. we are all human, and subject to sin ]
     
  7. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic)

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    You are very good at being devil's advocate, Thomas. Are you certain of your loyalties? Because you just made a very good point to all who value a just human society, reminding us that the gods' priorities are not primarily concerned with peace on earth and joy to the world ;)

    (Couldn't resist. I think I know what you meant to say)
     
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  8. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens

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    God's priority is the soul, imo
     
  9. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh, I don't object. Nor do I criticise, as I have no idea who Fatima Raza is, nor a broad understanding of her belief.

    It's just, these kinds of statements can come across as so ... "yeah, cool' you know? So right-on? Anodyne, bland and inoffensive to the point of being insubstantial. One of those 'I believe in everything / I believe in nothing' comments.

    This kind of statement could be said by someone with a deep and profound insight, or equally, by someone who is profoundly shallow ...

    +++

    The main point, which Cino alerts to, is that the Gods did not reveal nor inspire a message of humanity, of empathy.

    Nor did they say 'chill out, everything's copacetic' (I've carried that last word for years, having read it in "Neon Rain" in which James Lee Bourke introduces New Orleans detective Dave Robicheaux). In whatever relgion, even the religions of love – and aren't they all? – the Divine Voice comes across as somewhat authoritarian. I mean, Jesus' basic message is repent or face the consequences ...
     
  10. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    LOL. That's a bit why I posted!

    But, playing D'sA, humanitarianism has never been humanity's strong suit.

    More and more I think the Message is 'take responsibility for your actions or else' — the history of the Abrahamics starts with an 'it's not my fault!' moment.

    And religions have a strong humanitarian streak, although easily whitewashed out when religion serves its own human interests ...
     
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  11. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens

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    "In order to meet God we need to go where he is. We need to bow down, to humble ourselves, to make ourselves small"
    Pope Francis
     
  12. RabbiO

    RabbiO הרב יונה בן זכריה

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    The Kotzker Rebbe asked his students where G-d dwells. They answered that G-d is everywhere. To that the rebbe responded that where G-d dwells is wherever G-d is let in.
     
  13. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic)

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    I like that a lot, got me contemplating. "Letting in" to me implies opening, to spaciousness, room to move, acknowledging the void which is the medium of existence.

    Thank you, @RabbiO
     
  14. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens

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  15. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    Within temples, mosques, churches...in our midst, in our personal temple....our body...in him I live and breath and have my being.
     
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  16. Namaste Jesus

    Namaste Jesus Praise the Lord and Enjoy the Chai Staff Member

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    I'm reminded of this witticism of mine from a few years back.
    invited.JPG
     
  17. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic)

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    Now I'd like to play Devil's Advocate: So if I put religious symbols on my living room walls and participate in some charity (action), I get to slander my neighbors (words)?
     
  18. Namaste Jesus

    Namaste Jesus Praise the Lord and Enjoy the Chai Staff Member

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    Lost me there, Cino.... o_O
     
  19. Miken

    Miken Active Member

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    Same here.
     
  20. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic)

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    "Neither God nor Satan will enter your home uninvited, but beware. For who gets that invitation is determined by actions not words."

    My D.A. type query was, so if I perform pious actions but talk dirty about my fellow humans, by that witticism I would still get the benefit of a divine visitor rather than an infernal one, since it is my pious actions which determine the outcome, and not my nasty words?
     

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