Reading with New Eyes, Hearing with New Ears

Discussion in 'Belief and Spirituality' started by Tone Bristow-Stagg, Jul 23, 2022.

  1. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    In the Bible these verses to me have a deep meaning.

    1 Corinthians 2:9
    "But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him."

    Matthew 13:13-15
    "...13 This is why I speak to them in parables: “Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.
    14 In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: “ ‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
    15 For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.’..."

    To me there has been 3 Messengers from God after Jesus walked the earth and they were Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

    I see the Bible was written to prepare us for this day, the 'Day of God'. The above passages warn me, that in every age God sends Messengers, we all need to see with new eyes and hear with new ears.

    Most amazing thing is, when we do look at life through new eyes and hear with new ears, there is a greater possibility we will not reject what is of God, in preference of our own or other men's minds.

    I personally see that when Prophecy was given in the Torah, the Messages of Jesus, Muhammad, The Bab and Baha'u'llah were foretold. When Jesus Gave His Message, the Messaages of Muhammad, The Bab and Baha'u'llah were foretold. When Muhammad gave His Message, The Messages of the Bab and Baha'u'llah were foretold.

    So looking at these scriptures in hindsight, allows us to see those Messages contained within. From the New Testament we can see the 3 Woes are Muhammad, the Bab and the one that cones quickly, was Baha'u'llah.

    I look at a world that needs new eyes and new ears, as the Day of God has come, our unity is assured and most importantly the warnings of disunity given.

    I wonder what it will take?

    Revelation 22:10-13,
    “And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.”

    Isaiah 10:3
    "Now what will you do in the day of punishment, And in the devastation which will come from afar? To whom will you flee for help? And where will you leave your wealth?"


    God bless all, the reckoning is upon us. Regards Tony
     
  2. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2018
    Messages:
    3,226
    Likes Received:
    1,719
    Are you saying that every day is the day of reckoning? Isaiah and John the divine lived a long time ago, but they thought it was just about to happen, too.
     
    Tone Bristow-Stagg likes this.
  3. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    Every day we live is Judgement Day, we are all born into an age of a Messanger of God. The key is, is not rejecting those that came after the last Messenger.

    Scince Moses, we have had Jesus, Muhammad, The Bab and Baha'u'llah, (maybe more), all bringing us to this day, the Day of God foretold by Isaiah, the 'Age of Fullfillment'.

    Muhammad came as the Seal on the age of Prophecy, and age when God promised us of a Day where we would be one people, under the one God.

    This is an important topic. The issue is we have not realised how deep materialism has clouded our vision and ability to connect to the Holy Spirit, the Spirit that is Jesus the Christ.

    Regards Tony
     
  4. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2018
    Messages:
    3,226
    Likes Received:
    1,719
    There have been several we-publicised revelations since the lifetime of Baha'u'llah. Do you evaluate each of these to ensure you are not rejecting a new Messenger? After all, the time between the Bab and Baha'u'llah was shorter than that between Baha'u'llah and L. Ron Hubbard, to pick one of the better known (if infamous) examples.

    I think I generally understand what you mean, but want to ask what you mean by "materialism", as this word has so many different, sometimes contradictory meanings.
     
  5. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    Good question. The time between the Bab and Baha'u'llah was preordained as it is written in Prophecy, Elijah always cones first, so it may happen again? It is to early in a Revelation to understand what it has offered for a distant future.

    Luckily, I see the Bible gives timeless guidance as to who is a Messenger and one good sign is they bring a new Message from God, suited to the age. In the end they do not piggyback of another Messenger, but they will confirm the Messengers who have come before and most likely quote from them

    I see that false Prophets are wolves in sheep's clothing, intent on stealing a flock, not bringing the sheep together. This is always at a time when the flocks have wandered and are running wild, a God given Messenger will bring them all back, will not be exclusive.

    It has been recorded the next Messenger will not come before the expiration of a full 1000 years. It is written into the Book of Laws.

    "The Dispensation of Bahá’u’lláh will last until the coming of the next Manifestation of God, Whose advent will not take place before at least “a full thousand years” will have elapsed. Bahá’u’lláh cautions against ascribing to “this verse” anything other than its “obvious meaning”, and in one of His Tablets, He specifies that “each year” of this thousand year period consists of “twelve months according to the Qur’án, and of nineteen months of nineteen days each, according to the Bayán”.

    The intimation of His Revelation to Bahá’u’lláh in the Síyáh-Chál of Ṭihrán, in October 1852, marks the birth of His Prophetic Mission and hence the commencement of the one thousand years or more that must elapse before the appearance of the next Manifestation of God."

    So that is most likely an issue for a distant future? All I can say for now is that the world has to find unity, the guidance that has been given os copious.

    At the same time, God does as God so Wills.

    Sorry out if time, off to work.

    Regards Tony
     
  6. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    I see it is anything that takes us away from God. One can have all the riches this world offers, if one can use them as God has shown us to.

    Sorry off to work, so here are a few quotes on this topic, it is an immense topic!

    https://bahaiquotes.com/subject/materialism

    Regards Tony
     
  7. Ahanu

    Ahanu Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,568
    Likes Received:
    271
    . . . was prophesied by the Bab:

    "This, verily, is that which We promised thee, ere the moment We answered thy call. Wait thou until nine will have elapsed from the time of the Bayan. Then exclaim: 'Blessed be God, the most excellent of Makers!' We also answered aforetime, that ever the year Ta (9), it behooveth that two signs from the past, revealed by God in the Book, would be manifested in the year Vav (6). One of them is the prophet Yahya (John), and the other is the Son of Ali, the true and exalted Imam."
    -The Bab, Panj Sha'n
     
    Tone Bristow-Stagg likes this.
  8. Ahanu

    Ahanu Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,568
    Likes Received:
    271
    1000 years. Ancient Christianity and Judaism have something similar. See "Papias, Jesus, and the Miraculous Vines."
     
    Tone Bristow-Stagg likes this.
  9. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2018
    Messages:
    3,226
    Likes Received:
    1,719
    1000 is also a powerfully symbolic number. Apart from the literal meaning, what does it mean to you?
     
  10. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    To me I see it is symbolic for the age of a Manifestation of God, or a 'Day of God'.

    Regards Tony
     
  11. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    8,243
    Likes Received:
    1,883
    This assumes that the message of Muhammad 'tops' the message of Jesus. Many don't accept this? That the Quran tops the New Testament...
     
  12. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    No Message "Tops" another Message. It is like the rising of the sun on a new day. The sun rises on a slightly different point of the horizon, and accordingly to the weather of the day, will shine to the extent that the clouds have gathered.

    In this age the sun rose on a day that was very dense in cloud cover.

    Regards Tony
     
  13. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2018
    Messages:
    3,226
    Likes Received:
    1,719
    But one day follows another, to stay with this imagery. How long does a day last?

    Or is it just about the sunrise, not the day?
     
  14. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    The Bible offers a 'Day of God' is like unto 1000 years. In the end the dispensation of a Messenger is preordained by God.

    Each Day of God also has the seasons. Spring being the rising of the Message, then the summer, an autumn and then the winter of that Message. Thus God again with spring makes all things new.

    There is a lot of these Metephor that explain the cycles of God, as the material is reflected from the Spiritual reality.

    Regards Tony
     
  15. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2018
    Messages:
    3,226
    Likes Received:
    1,719
    So to get back to RJM's question, which you kind of sidestepped, at least to my reading of your answers -

    - if you don't believe that newer revelations are superior in some way, then what does the "new sunrise" metaphor mean to you?
     
    RJM likes this.
  16. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    8,243
    Likes Received:
    1,883
    Post removed. It adds nothing to the discussion. Sorry
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2022
  17. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    I see It is a progressive revelation we get from God.

    Our education in this world is a progression. Every subsequent year of education does not make what we previously learnt inferior, as they are the building blocks of our understanding, it all adds to our understanding.

    We have learnt a great deal, we have an infinite amount still to discover.

    The Revelations of the Bab and Baha'u'llah have unlocked the door to all knowledge. This ancient tradition fulfillment was offered for us to consider. It is Baha'u'llah talking about the Message of the Bab (Gate) and what had been promised. I put in bold the key point.

    "..No understanding can grasp the nature of His Revelation, nor can any knowledge comprehend the full measure of His Faith. All sayings are dependent upon His sanction, and all things stand in need of His Cause. All else save Him are created by His command, and move and have their being through His law. He is the Revealer of the divine mysteries, and the Expounder of the hidden and ancient wisdom. Thus it is related in the "Biháru'l-Anvár," the "'Avalim," and the "Yanbú'" of Sádiq, son of Muhammad, that he spoke these words: "Knowledge is twenty and seven letters. All that the Prophets have revealed are two letters thereof. No man thus far hath known more than these two letters. But when the Qá'im shall arise, He will cause the remaining twenty and five letters to be made manifest." Consider; He hath declared Knowledge to consist of twenty and seven letters, and regarded all the Prophets, from Adam even unto the "Seal," as Expounders of only two letters thereof and of having been sent down with these two letters. He also saith that the Qá'im will reveal all the remaining twenty and five letters. Behold from this utterance how great and lofty is His station! His rank excelleth that of all the Prophets, and His Revelation transcendeth the comprehension and understanding of all their chosen ones. A Revelation, of which the Prophets of God, His saints and chosen ones, have either not been informed, or which, in pursuance of God's inscrutable Decree, they have not disclosed,..."

    There is a mystery in the fact that a Revelation is expounded on the one hand as excelling all others and then in the other hand knowing that there is No Distinction to be made between any of God's Messengers. To me this is an understanding of the Oneness of God. That each part of creation is naught but pure amazement and wonderment and on the other hand part of the whole.

    Regards Tony
     
  18. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    It can all add to the discussion. Regards Tony
     
    RJM likes this.
  19. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    8,243
    Likes Received:
    1,883
    Ok. Obviously the main issue, leaving Baha'i out of it for now, is that certainly Jews do not accept Christianity as a new (superior) revelation, nor certainly do Christians accept Islam as a new revelation. It goes back a long time?
     
    Tone Bristow-Stagg likes this.
  20. Tone Bristow-Stagg

    Tone Bristow-Stagg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    147
    Yes it is all about choice. I also see it is not about being superior. When the sun rises each day, we do not say it is superior to the sun of yesterday.

    What makes the difference is the clouds that obscure the Sun, and they are the clouds that all Messengers return upon.

    Those clouds are our perceptions we have made about our faith and of God.

    Regards Tony
     

Share This Page