Right to bear arms

[wil]

We can argue all day....or lifetime about this.

It isn't like we have laws and crime rates in other nations to look at as examples to where we could come to any confusion as to whether the issue of deaths by gunfire could be reduced or anything.

The American love affair with the gun is a fairy tale fear based attraction in my opinion.

It is weird to me how pro life advocates are often pro gun as well.

 

[moralorel]

You might not agree with it, but I don't know how it can be deemed irrational.
..but then, I live in the UK, where the number of guns in circulation is tightly controlled.

As you probably know, only a small number of police officers are armed in the UK.
eg. serious crime squad or terrorist related


It is not a question of whether "guns are to blame" .. it is a question of statistics.
It is not unreasonable to think that crimes involving guns is likely to increase with the number in circulation, I would have thought.

Punishing the innocent because bad people did something? I see that as irrational. The U.K. is notorious for controlling people by taking away their ability to defend themselves. Just ask the Irish and the Scots.

Statistics? The more people who own cars, the more people who die in car accidents. Ban cars. The more people who own swimming pools, the more people who drown in swimming pools. Ban swimming pools. The more people who own guns, the more people who will die by the gun. Ban guns. In my country, murders involving cars have increased. So I do hope we ban cars.

It is NOT unreasonable to think that crimes involving cars will increase with the circulation of cars.

Swimming pools are known child-killers. Based on statistics alone those things should be banned. Don't even get me started on trampolines.

 

[moralorel]

We can argue all day....or lifetime about this.

It isn't like we have laws and crime rates in other nations to look at as examples to where we could come to any confusion as to whether the issue of deaths by gunfire could be reduced or anything.

The American love affair with the gun is a fairy tale fear based attraction in my opinion.

It is weird to me how pro life advocates are often pro gun as well.

It's weird that pro-choice people are often for gun control and the forcing of vaccines on the populace.

To each his/her own contradictions.

 

[wil]

Simply pro science...

More choice before before conception, more choice before birth, less unwanted children in the world.

Vaccines saved us from needing more refrigerated trucks at hospitals around the country.

More guns equals more gun deaths, more vet suicides.

Science.

 

[moralorel]

Simply pro science...

More choice before before conception, more choice before birth, less unwanted children in the world.

Vaccines saved us from needing more refrigerated trucks at hospitals around the country.

More guns equals more gun deaths, more vet suicides.

Science.

You confuse opinion and politics with science. If you are pro-science, you will ALWAYS question scientific results. Including when they make sense. But I'm willing to bet your "pro science" bias fits nicely with the narrative that we hear on most liberal news networks and that are echoed by liberal politicians. Science is NOT what you are adhering to. You are taking your opinion, finding people who agree with you, and then agreeing to whatever "science" they hand to you. That is NOT science. If you were pro science, you would be skeptical of the very things you said in your statements above.

My point to you about abortion and vaccines was the "my body my choice' contradiction. That's not science.

Every vaccine is different. Like I said before, I used to work in the medical field. I am still amazed at how many people see vaccines in black and white... and how many need a history lesson on mandated vaccines by our lovely governments. I have to argue with people who see every vaccine like they are all the same, equally as safe, and equally as effective. There are so many variables to every vaccine that it is so difficult to explain. Likewise I have to constantly dispel lies that are told by antivaxxers. But that's because I'm pro science.

More guns, more knives, more cars, more sugar, more swimming pools, yada yada yada... science!

Guns are banned in Japan. Japan has the highest suicide rate in the world. Guess which method is the #2 method for suicides. Guns. Science!

Guns don't stop suicidal thoughts. Also science.

 

[RJM]

Now there are Trump supporters threatening to take up their guns and create 'civil war' if he goes down.

Who are they taking up arms against? While the army and police and security apparatus remain loyal to the government? Who do they plan on killing?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Statistics? The more people who own cars, the more people who die in car accidents. Ban cars..

Umm .. perhaps one needs to know more about HOW these people die?
I doubt whether they would die, if they slowed down a bit .. perhaps a speed limit would be more appropriate..

..and what are cars designed to do? What are guns designed to do?
No .. it's false equivalence.
In my opinion, the more guns in circulation, the more people will feel it's necessary to own
one to defend themselves.

 

[wil]

more people who own cars, the more people who die in car accidents. Ban cars. The more people who own swimming pools, the more people who drown in swimming pools. Ban swimming pools

Lol...I am sick and tired of seeing all the mass drownings in swimming pools. And they haul pools to schools to attack children.

I am just gonna ride my gun to work to make money.

But hey, if you need a warm gun to sleep with what ya do in your own home is your business.

I find it extremely difficult to have any serious conversations with those silly arguments.

 

[moralorel]

Umm .. perhaps one needs to know more about HOW these people die?
I doubt whether they would die, if they slowed down a bit .. perhaps a speed limit would be more appropriate..

..and what are cars designed to do? What are guns designed to do?
No .. it's false equivalence.
In my opinion, the more guns in circulation, the more people will feel it's necessary to own
one to defend themselves.

Actually this makes my point even more valid. We can't deny that one of the purposes of guns is to kill. But swimming pools are NOT meant to kill. Yet they are definitely quite effective at killing people. Cars are an even better example of my point. They are NOT meant for killing, yet there has been quite a rise in vehicular manslaughters and vehicular murders. So if we're worried about people dying, we should do the right thing and ban pools and cars. Definitely should ban sugar.

 

[moralorel]

Lol...I am sick and tired of seeing all the mass drownings in swimming pools. And they haul pools to schools to attack children.

I am just gonna ride my gun to work to make money.

But hey, if you need a warm gun to sleep with what ya do in your own home is your business.

I find it extremely difficult to have any serious conversations with those silly arguments.

You used correlation as a way to prove your point. I easily pointed out how correlations can be used to disprove your stance. You had to result to mockery. I guess you had nothing else to stand on.

 

[moralorel]

Lol...I am sick and tired of seeing all the mass drownings in swimming pools. And they haul pools to schools to attack children.

I am just gonna ride my gun to work to make money.

But hey, if you need a warm gun to sleep with what ya do in your own home is your business.

I find it extremely difficult to have any serious conversations with those silly arguments.

I this another example of you being "pro science"? Nice.

 

[muhammad_isa]

..if we're worried about people dying, we should do the right thing and ban pools and cars. Definitely should ban sugar.

Well, clearly, you like living in a society where people regularly carry guns. I have never lived in such a society, and have no wish to do so.

Do you imagine that people will be carrying weapons capable of killing each other in paradise/heaven ?

 

[wil]

I this another example of you being "pro science"? Nice.

There is no discussing logic with 2a folks...I say that because I was one. You usually have to have a family member die by "accident" and I don't wish that on anyone.

 

[moralorel]

Well, clearly, you like living in a society where people regularly carry guns. I have never lived in such a society, and have no wish to do so.

Do you imagine that people will be carrying weapons capable of killing each other in paradise/heaven ?

Strawman. I don't like people carrying guns around. No need to make up lies about me. I don't live in a society like this.

It wouldn't be paradise if we had to carry weapons. I would assume in your paradise everyone could go to God with questions. I guarantee His advice would be much better than anything anyone could suggest on here. That is why it would be paradise.

 

[moralorel]

You haven't used any sound logic yet, so no need to point fingers unless you point at yourself. I expected a better argument out of you Wil. I really do enjoy your commentary.

Accident? You have absolutely no idea the type of nightmare my life has been. My life has only improved because I saw the irrational and responded rationally. Like I said before, trying to rationalize the irrational usually leads to irrational logic. Stop proving me right.

 

[muhammad_isa]

I don't like people carrying guns around..

Oh, sorry .. I just assumed..

It wouldn't be paradise if we had to carry weapons..

Agreed..
..so you are arguing from a liberal, idealistic viewpoint then..
It is that you don't like the State telling people what they can and can't do.

I would assume in your paradise everyone could go to God with questions. I guarantee His advice would be much better than anything anyone could suggest on here. That is why it would be paradise.

My understanding, is that the correct path to tread in this life, not only leads to paradise in the next life,
but improves the 'condition' of this life too.
It is NOT just about the salvation of the individual, but of the whole community .. the foundation
of the very civilization that we live in.
..but I would agree that we can never actually achieve paradise in this life .. but that should not
be for want of trying.

 

[RJM]

Removed

The American National Rifle Association don't care what I say ...

 

[Aupmanyav]

No need for it except for some people who have a danger of being attacked, police permission is required.
Killing humans as well as hunting is unlawful in India.