pagan prophecy?

TheLovableNicola

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should we give credit to a pagan prophecy of Christ?

Or should such prophecy be disregarded and why?

here is a quote from Virgil's fourth eclogue.
"Now the last age by Cumae’s Sibyl sung
Has come and gone, and the majestic roll
Of circling centuries begins anew:
Justice returns, returns old Saturn’s reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.
Only do thou, at the boy’s birth in whom
The iron shall cease, the golden age arise…
Under thy guidance, whatso tracks remain
Of our old wickedness, once done away
Shall free the earth from never-ceasing fear.
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling, and himself
Be seen of them, and with his father’s worth
Reign o’er a world at peace"
 
Dear TheLovableNicola

Interesting that in July of this year we would have completed a two and half year cycle in Saturn in Cancer which is all about humanity taking responsibility and one of the Christian scriptures also mentions saturn.

Also the scholars that translated the NIV state that the message in the bible is clear that GOD wishes us to take responsibility for what we co-create. As stated in Genesis, wonderful confirmation.

"Be responsible for fish in the sea and birds in the air, for every living thing that moves on the face of the Earth."

Woe betide people that do not honour GOD's creation and continue to destroy the earth, for its states in the bible those that destroy the earth will themselves be destroyed.

Rev:21:4 NIV He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning, or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away". 4 He who was seated on the throne said:

I am making everything new! Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true."

So I would say the pagan prophecy rings true. Thank you for sharing.

being love

kim xx
 
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TheLovableNicola said:
should we give credit to a pagan prophecy of Christ?

Or should such prophecy be disregarded and why?

here is a quote from Virgil's fourth eclogue.
"Now the last age by Cumae’s Sibyl sung
Has come and gone, and the majestic roll
Of circling centuries begins anew:
Justice returns, returns old Saturn’s reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.
Only do thou, at the boy’s birth in whom
The iron shall cease, the golden age arise…
Under thy guidance, whatso tracks remain
Of our old wickedness, once done away
Shall free the earth from never-ceasing fear.
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling, and himself
Be seen of them, and with his father’s worth
Reign o’er a world at peace"
Hmmm, Native Americans' Shamen prophisised of the coming of a world savior, being one with father God...why not accept the Celtic diviner's vision?

As Jesus stated, ...let them who have an ear, hear.

v/r

Q
 
should we give credit to a pagan prophecy of Christ?

Or should such prophecy be disregarded and why?
These are very good questions

To the first question I say NO
Not because the prophecy isnt about Christ it may very well be. But because it doesnt fit in with what the bible says contains Light. The wise men that came to Christ sometime around his birth they may have very well been pagen. I believe the True God has been known to cultures since creation but as Christians we look to The God of Abraham Issac Jacob and The Father of Jesus. Knowing of Christ and Knowing Christ are two very diferent things.

To the second question should they be disregarded well that depends on how you regard them. Do they strengthen your Desire to Know God and His word or do they distract you with fairytales of other "gods" and confuse the simple truth of Gods Word.
Again I quote the verse that best fits.

Isa 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

I myself am glad you shared this with me it only strengthens my desire to know God but on the other hand it shows how easy my God can be mingled in with false gods in a mans writing so that truely the Light of truth does not shine very bright.
 
Basstian said:
These are very good questions

To the first question I say NO
Not because the prophecy isnt about Christ it may very well be. But because it doesnt fit in with what the bible says contains Light. The wise men that came to Christ sometime around his birth they may have very well been pagen. I believe the True God has been known to cultures since creation but as Christians we look to The God of Abraham Issac Jacob and The Father of Jesus. Knowing of Christ and Knowing Christ are two very diferent things.

To the second question should they be disregarded well that depends on how you regard them. Do they strengthen your Desire to Know God and His word or do they distract you with fairytales of other "gods" and confuse the simple truth of Gods Word.
Again I quote the verse that best fits.

Isa 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

I myself am glad you shared this with me it only strengthens my desire to know God but on the other hand it shows how easy my God can be mingled in with false gods in a mans writing so that truely the Light of truth does not shine very bright.
Agreed, but for one small thing. God can call to anyone He wishes, and He can impart His wisdom where He will. Who are we to decide who gets the message and who doesn't? ;) Babies are fed milk, not meat...

v/r

Q
 
For some reason I just thought of Jonah He was sent to Ninevah far off to the east os Isreal to warn a pagen city. And I ask myself why would God Care?

I know the answer Because He Loves and wants the best for all cultures and beliefs whether they want Him or not. He is not a respecter of persons.

So Yes Q He could and would call anybody at will. But we must use the scripture to prove the message whether it be of God or not. And we have very clear guidlines for doing that The Law and the Testimony.
 
Basstian said:
For some reason I just thought of Jonah He was sent to Ninevah far off to the east os Isreal to warn a pagen city. And I ask myself why would God Care?

I know the answer Because He Loves and wants the best for all cultures and beliefs whether they want Him or not. He is not a respecter of persons.

So Yes Q He could and would call anybody at will. But we must use the scripture to prove the message whether it be of God or not. And we have very clear guidlines for doing that The Law and the Testimony.
Dear Basstian,

One cannot condemn a people who have never heard of Christ, or of Judeasm, but have seen the future of man, and identified the "Savior" of man, even in pagan faiths. To do so, is to be as guilty in arrogance as the Sehedrin that condemned Jesus to death...

You understand I pray...we are not them...

v/r

Q
 
Just to be clear that is what I was saying too.
God does care and so should we not embracing doctrines of other faiths but embracing the goodness in each and striving to lead them to the truth.

Jonah's mission was a good example of that.
 
Basstian said:
Just to be clear that is what I was saying too.
God does care and so should we not embracing doctrines of other faiths but embracing the goodness in each and striving to lead them to the truth.

Jonah's mission was a good example of that.
Arrogance, fear and denial is what put Jonah in water over his head...
 
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling,
Justice returns, returns old Saturn’s reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.


IMO THIS IS A REAL GOOD CLUE TO DO AWAY WITH IT.

i dont really have much to say about this topic because most of this stuff that gets posted in Christianity I feel is an attempt to persuade in a direction away from the bible rather than toward it. Some pull up God is Love and scripture and the next thing you know they are teaching worship the moon, saturn and the earth goddess.

Israel departed from the worship of the true God and were repeatedly warned by God about the consequences of practicing a false worship system. One of Israel's major departures from God's worship system was their tendency to worship and serve gods represented by the heavenly bodies and to ignore their God who created and positioned the planets and stars to serve humanity

more often than not, this is not for a question of what should we do, but rather lets leave the bible and search the other path. This is very easily seen in the direction of ones speech and the things they speak of.

10:14Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.
10:15I speak as to wise men; judge ye what I say.
10:16The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?
10:17For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.
10:18Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the altar?
10:19What say I then? that the idol is any thing, or that which is offered in sacrifice to idols is any thing?
10:20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.
10:21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.


But we must use the scripture to prove the message whether it be of God or not.
Yes and exactly.
I see things like this as a potential for another brother being caught in a snare more often than those who are desiring sincere milk.

Thanks but no thanks. i wont be adding anything else to this
 
I must wholly agree with Bandit on this
I had started out in a meek manner to try to softly turn you towards the Bible
I was right in doing so.
But Bandits Hardline stance is more than appropriate for this type of thing.

So there you have it a still small voice and a voice crying in the wilderness both saying the same thing.

Prove those things whether they be of God.
 
Dear Q

I was under the impression that Jonah lacked the courage to face the people with GOD's message hence why he ran away from his mission. I sure could not blame him! But as we know there is no running away from GOD's will.

Dear Bandit

Did GOD not make the sunlight for the daytime and the moon to provide light of a night so that we could find our way. Everything in creation as an excellent reason for being for GOD is the best architect!

Dear TheLovableNicola

Do you have any more to share ?

Has come and gone, and the majestic roll
Of circling centuries begins anew:
Justice returns, returns old Saturn’s reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.
Only do thou, at the boy’s birth in whom
The iron shall cease, the golden age arise…
Under thy guidance, whatso tracks remain
Of our old wickedness, once done away
Shall free the earth from never-ceasing fear.
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling, and himself
Be seen of them, and with his father’s worth
Reign o’er a world at peace"

The iron shall cease is also very important as the darkness on our planet is often referred to as the 'Iron Fist' that we face. This prophecy is wonderful confirmation 'shall free the earth from never ceasing fear' and it is written that the word Jerusalem actually means 'Vision of Peace'.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
 
PS I feel we should always give credit where credit is due and honour all religions, cultures and races.
 
Sacredstar said:
Dear Q

I was under the impression that Jonah lacked the courage to face the people with GOD's message hence why he ran away from his mission. I sure could not blame him! But as we know there is no running away from GOD's will.

Dear Bandit

Did GOD not make the sunlight for the daytime and the moon to provide light of a night so that we could find our way. Everything in creation as an excellent reason for being for GOD is the best architect!

Dear TheLovableNicola

Do you have any more to share ?

Has come and gone, and the majestic roll
Of circling centuries begins anew:
Justice returns, returns old Saturn’s reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.
Only do thou, at the boy’s birth in whom
The iron shall cease, the golden age arise…
Under thy guidance, whatso tracks remain
Of our old wickedness, once done away
Shall free the earth from never-ceasing fear.
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling, and himself
Be seen of them, and with his father’s worth
Reign o’er a world at peace"

The iron shall cease is also very important as the darkness on our planet is often referred to as the 'Iron Fist' that we face. This prophecy is wonderful confirmation 'shall free the earth from never ceasing fear' and it is written that the word Jerusalem actually means 'Vision of Peace'.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
Understood Sacred,

However, Pagan thought (no matter how wise) does not sit well within a Christian setting. You are being un fair to those who wish to discuss "Christian thought". You I'm afraid, are placing stumbling stones in front of the faithful, and it appears that you do so deliberately. That is not right...

You said you were going to start a new thread on EGO and God...I look forward to that.

v/r

Q
 
Dear Q

Quahom1 said:
Understood Sacred,

However, Pagan thought (no matter how wise) does not sit well within a Christian setting. You are being un fair to those who wish to discuss "Christian thought". You I'm afraid, are placing stumbling stones in front of the faithful, and it appears that you do so deliberately. That is not right...

You said you were going to start a new thread on EGO and God...I look forward to that. Q

Well I feel that is a rather harsh statement, as this pagan prophecy fits perfectly with my own and other Christians direct communion with Christ.
So it seems that Christian fundamentalist thought is the only thing that is considered to be Christian on this forum? Is that fair and just? I think not !

Nothing is a stone in the path of the faithful lest those that put them there themselves, nothing stops anyone from sharing their hearts and love. But this is the era of unity and unity is about sharing, community, embracing not rejecting or resisting so let us share in the love of Christ and drop any misconceptions of any perceived injustice.

I posted the conversation with GOD on Ego earlier today you can find it in the alternative forum.

Love beyond measure


Kim xx

PS As soon as I saw pagan prophecy on the Christian forum I thought oh dear......maybe it should have been on comparative?
 
Sacredstar said:
Dear Q



Well I feel that is a rather harsh statement, as this pagan prophecy fits perfectly with my own and other Christians direct communion with Christ.
So it seems that Christian fundamentalist thought is the only thing that is considered to be Christian on this forum? Is that fair and just? I think not !

Nothing is a stone in the path of the faithful lest those that put them there themselves, nothing stops anyone from sharing their hearts and love. But this is the era of unity and unity is about sharing, community, embracing not rejecting or resisting so let us share in the love of Christ and drop any misconceptions of any perceived injustice.

I posted the conversation with GOD on Ego earlier today you can find it in the alternative forum.

Love beyond measure


Kim xx

PS As soon as I saw pagan prophecy on the Christian forum I thought oh dear......maybe it should have been on comparative?
I'm not being harsh, and I think you know that. I would enjoy your thoughts (as I do now). But I merely suggested (or implied) that they be placed in the Spirituality area.

Kiddo, on certain issues, I'd be happy to debate with you until the cows come home! :D

Others may not find this so fun...

My deepest respect, Sacred.


Q
 
TheLovableNicola said:
should we give credit to a pagan prophecy of Christ?

Or should such prophecy be disregarded and why?
Well displayed here in the posts are good reasons for disregarding pagen prophecy as being a Christian thing at least according to the Bible.

We are to flee from Idoltary. There are some that will say everything is good but they put you in a very grey area where you find it hard to decern the truth from fiction or I might say Jesus from Pagen.

These type of things will and should always bring out Staunch Defenders of Gods word and Truth when introduced as Godly and thus lead to controversy which is never pretty.

I feel I showed you a very easy and true guidline to use from the scripture.
I hope it guides you well.
Another bit of advice.....Be strong in faith and Grounded well in Gods word and its truth before you explore much. This world is a dangerous dark place without a good source of light.

Thy Word is a Lamp unto My Feet and a Light unto My Path ;)
 
I think it would be helpful if we were to tighten up our terminology:

Pagan is a Latin word originally used by pre-Christian Romans to describe the nature-worship styles of country-dwellers. It derives from the same root as "peasant". If we mean "non-Christian" we should say so, to avoid confusion. Many people today call themselves Pagan, but do not necessarily share anything ancient Romans or any other religion.

An idol is not a god. An idol is an image. Idol worshippers are not the same as non-Christians. Isn't there a danger we are becoming obsessed by the *name* of God, forgetting his identity? If he changed his "name", would we still know him?

A Gentile is a non-Jew. Most Christians are Gentiles. To quote a verse lambasting Gentiles does our cause no good at all.

If a Roman poet may not be respected, who can? Presumably we can use Jewish prophets, but what about modern Jewish writers? If a writer is Christian may we believe him / her? If so, does that extend to retired Bishop Spong? Is it only the Bible we can trust? Has God stopped speaking to his creation then? What did we do to offend him?

Basically, I'm saying that I'm reading a lot of knee-jerk stuff here which hasn't been at all carefully thought through. Let's elevate the debate.
 
Sacredstar said:
So it seems that Christian fundamentalist thought is the only thing that is considered to be Christian on this forum? Is that fair and just? I think not !
Of course it's neither fair nor just, but neither is trying to trash mainstream Christian thought, and preaching to Christians that the New Testament is one big polluted lie and that your own perspective is superior.

Ultimately, Fundamentalism is about being closed-minded, ignorant, and dismissive of other peoples opinions as valid and just.

Some Christians do it. Some Atheists do it. Some Muslims do it. And some Liberals do it.

We've been seeing far too much of that here on the Christianity board - it is a board for discussing Christian issues and issues relating to Christianity.

From an administrative point of view, clear principles laid down for the use of CR and its forums need upholding, and that means that people who call themselves Christian, but simply reference Jesus rather than subscribe to any particular organised Christian belief system, should not feel it's their place to dismiss mainstream Christian ideals on the Christianity board - this is just as Christians here should not witness at Wiccans on the NeoPaganism board.

I've tried to allow as free-reign as possible for everyone in CR - we tend to attract mostly very tolerant peope, no matter their degree of adherence to their faith. However, there are issues that need taking care off.

Juantoo3 is the current moderator for the Christianity board, but as soon as I've posted this, Quahom will join him. If he feels that any particular posts are inappropriate for the Christianity board, he will be empowered to move them to more appropriate place.We need to return to core principles and give people freedom of expression within CR, rather than outside of its remit.



Sacredstar said:
PS As soon as I saw pagan prophecy on the Christian forum I thought oh dear......maybe it should have been on comparative?
Yes, I thought that at first - but at its heart is the question of why Christians do not accept essentially pagan interpretations of prophecy, which seems a reasonable enough question to ask Christians. :)
 
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