eternal life

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didymus

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I was reading the gospels and came across some passages regarding eternal life. The answers given the people were from Jesus himself. I was surprised at what I read.

Mark 10:17-21
Matthew 19:16- 21
Luke 18:18-22

in all cases a man approaches jesus and asks him how to inherit eternal life. In each case Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. It isn't until Jesus is questioned further that he says the man should sell all he owns and give to the poor. to this he adds that the man will receive trasure in heaven. If Jesus had not been further questioned his reply to follow the commandments would have sufficed.

According to Jesus, in order to inherit eternal life one needs only follow the commandments. In order to enter the kingdom of God more needs to be done; sell belongings , give to the poor, follow Jesus. to me these passages distinguish between the "kingdom of god" and eternal life. I never noticed this before and I feel very excited about this find. eternal life is not granted by any doctrinal or religious beliefs it is about being a good person. The ten commandments can be followed by anybody with a good heart. There is no doctrine in them at all.

Jesus illustrates the kingdom of God as; Mark 4:30 a mustard seed, Luke 17:21 the kingdom of God is within you. John 3:3 You must be born again to see the kingdom of God.
 
to me these passages distinguish between the "kingdom of god" and eternal life.
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It seems so. Perhaps the kingdom of god can be found here, in this life, while eternal life only comes post-resurrection?

eternal life is not granted by any doctrinal or religious beliefs it is about being a good person. The ten commandments can be followed by anybody with a good heart. There is no doctrine in them at all.
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Yeah, but isn't the first commandment "Thou shalt not have strange gods before me"? So, that seems to limit the scope down to those of the Abrahamic faiths...
 
Yes, it would imply that. The commandments say to have one God only.
 
So religious beliefs do have an impact on our eternal life...it isn't solely about being a good person, although that is one facet of it...
 
If you consider one God only religious then you can say that.:)
 
If I remember right, didn't Jesus also state there were just 2 commandments? :)
 
Hmmm, I thought it was two greatest, and all the rest hung from those two.

34Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. 35One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” 37Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38This is the first and greatest commandment. 39And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[c] 40All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

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lunamoth
 
didymus said:
According to Jesus, in order to inherit eternal life one needs only follow the commandments. In order to enter the kingdom of God more needs to be done; sell belongings , give to the poor, follow Jesus. to me these passages distinguish between the "kingdom of god" and eternal life. I never noticed this before and I feel very excited about this find. eternal life is not granted by any doctrinal or religious beliefs it is about being a good person. The ten commandments can be followed by anybody with a good heart. There is no doctrine in them at all.

Jesus illustrates the kingdom of God as; Mark 4:30 a mustard seed, Luke 17:21 the kingdom of God is within you. John 3:3 You must be born again to see the kingdom of God.
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Didn't Jesus also state that if you broke one commandment, you broke them all? That's a pretty tall order to try and get through one's whole life without one slip up...

v/r

Q
 
But he didn't say if you break one then you'll burn in eternal flames either.:eek:
 
KnightoftheRose said:
It seems so. Perhaps the kingdom of god can be found here, in this life, while eternal life only comes post-resurrection?
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this is how I see that too Knight:) . Later it shows Jesus delivering the Kingdom to God, that would be eternal life. or post resurrection.
I think the Kingdom of heaven is now and has been since Pentecost when the holy ghost was given and the kingdom of God is being gathered over time.

the kingdom of heaven is like a man on a far journey

(a little complicated complicated but not too bad)
 
Jesus' statement was clear. Follow the commandments and you'll inherit eternal life. This should be good news to all.
 
didymus said:
Jesus' statement was clear. Follow the commandments and you'll inherit eternal life. This should be good news to all.
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Inherit eternal life, but not enter the Kingdom of heaven, I'm I correct in your implication? ;)

Well if one has accepted Christ yet breaks one of the ten commandments, shall still not only have eternal life, but be granted access into the Kingdom of Heaven, even if it is only just inside the gates:

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 5:17-19).

If we strive to obey these laws so that we may feel righteous and better than others, we have already broken them. If we strive to keep these commandments in an outward manner, while neglecting the inner principles of them, we are worse than a lawbreaker–we are a hypocrite.

And according to Luke 18:10-14:
10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

Keeping the ten commandments is not enough unless they are kept both externally and internally. And we can't keep them internally unless we have a Love for God first and foremost. Then the two mutally strengthen us into mature and loving people of God. Find first God and you find love. Keep His commandments and you learn how to Love. The first four commandments deal with our relationship with God, while the remaining six deal with our relationship with eachother.

The lawyers and Pharisees knew the word and thought they had eternal life through it, but they were deceived. The word of God was not in their hearts. Jesus also pointed out that it was impossible for them to believe in Him, as long as they were seeking honor from each other, rather than God.

"And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honour from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?" (John 5:37-44).
The very best and pious of the people of Israel were famous for keeping the ten commandments, and it got them condemnation, yet the poorest sinner asking for forgiveness from God for his sins (failing to keep these same commandments) found favor in eyes of God.

I ah, notice you staying away from John, James, and others when making your argument. I like to look at the whole picture, not just a slice here or there.

v/r

Q
 
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Brian said:
If I remember right, didn't Jesus also state there were just 2 commandments? :)
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LOL everybody says that as if to limit the number of commandments. Jesus Quoted scripture the same way I quoted your post.
Had He chose one commandment over another He would went against the Law its self.
He was already being tested by the scribes to see if they could trick Him into saying something that would go against God He didnt.
The scripture is found.
Deut 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
AND
Le 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Not new Laws not just two Laws but scripture to support ALL the Law. How could they argue about that. He aced their test and proved He could not be tricked into going against the will of His Father
 
Yes Q, I am implying that there was a clear differnce between eternal life and the kingdom of God. One had nothing to do with the other. The kingdom of God was heaven on earth, a true dying to the self born again experience. This I believe is at the heart of what Jesus preached.
 
didymus said:
Yes Q, I am implying that there was a clear differnce between eternal life and the kingdom of God. One had nothing to do with the other. The kingdom of God was heaven on earth, a true dying to the self born again experience. This I believe is at the heart of what Jesus preached.
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I'm not sure about the first part, but I would agree with the last two sentences.

lunamoth
 
didymus said:
Yes Q, I am implying that there was a clear differnce between eternal life and the kingdom of God. One had nothing to do with the other. The kingdom of God was heaven on earth, a true dying to the self born again experience. This I believe is at the heart of what Jesus preached.
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you know what Did, now that I think about what you've said, I am beginning to understand. Let us take those people who lived from Adam up to Jesus birth. All they had was the OT, and promises (plus the old covanent). And suppose some of them did not have the oppertunity to know the Hebrew laws but did know the Noahidic laws (the seven rather than ten), and kept them as best they could. They died, and rest in the grave (with no sense of time passing).

They must stand judgement, but it would not be fair to judge them by standards set after Jesus time... (bear with me a moment).

Now we have those who have lived since Jesus came, and we have the advantage of the Grace and presence of the Holy Spirit continuing in our lives (those of us who know and accept Jesus). We will stand in judgement however, it will not be with the same standard as the group before us.

Finally if Revelations is correct, those who live during the 1000 years of peace will physically be aware of the presence of the living God on earth while they live, hence they will stand judgement to a different set of standards than the first or second group.

So, the first group will be brought back from the grave (whole in body and soul), and stand the "White Thrown Judgement" wherein the word shall be open to them and each will have a full measure of life to realize the truth of Jesus. Also, their names will be searched for in the books...

The second group will be judged as Christians who have accepted Jesus, not concerning eternal life, but rather what rewards they have stored in heaven while living as Christians (what fruits did they bring forth once their eyes were opened). Blessed are they that have not seen, but believe...

The third group will be judged knowing Jesus full well, having lived with Him.

In that light, I can agree that there are those who will have eternal life by having kept the commandments in their hearts as well as in daily life.

v/r

Q
 
Its not possible to follow the 10 commandments.. If you even look at your neighbors wife with lust you are breaking that commandment and breaking that one commandment you are breaking them all.. '

That was the purpose of the sacrifice Jesus made because there is no way we could repay the debt we make by sinning every day. There is no such thing as a "good person". The only truly good person died on calvary to be resurrected 3 days later. :)

I see what your trying to say did... you are wanting to know if someone can get there without Jesus... according to my bible you cannot.

might I also correct the something... the first commandment is actually "Thall shalt have no other gods before me......"
 
Hey, here's a random thought...

In Mahayana Buddhism, Nirvana is a condition experienced wholly within Samsara...in other words, the quality of permanence can be experienced in an impermanent existence...

Perhaps the same is true with Christianity. The "Kingdom of God" is Heaven experienced within this lifetime (at least partially) - the peace, joy, and fellowship with God that will come in the afterlife can be experienced now, in this world of hate and suffering...

Or maybe I'm just an idiot who needs to keep his mouth shut..:p
 
I am looking solely at what Jesus said. Follow the commandments to inherit eternal life. What contradicts this statement made by Jesus? Show me the passage. Jesus said follow the commandments, not if you do a, b or c or if you were born before or after. he was clear in his reply. Jesus never said that after my resurrectyion if you believe in me you'll have eternal life. he was preaching the kingdom of God here on earth. The kingdom is within you. Case and point.

Faithful, your statement that nobody is good was very disturbing to me. Is this what you really believe, that nobody is good? Why don't you reconsider that. I believe the majority of people in the world are inherently good. Everybody is tempted to do evil but that does not make them evil people.

You say only Jesus was good. Look at Mark 10:18
 
KnightoftheRose said:
Hey, here's a random thought...

In Mahayana Buddhism, Nirvana is a condition experienced wholly within Samsara...in other words, the quality of permanence can be experienced in an impermanent existence...

Perhaps the same is true with Christianity. The "Kingdom of God" is Heaven experienced within this lifetime (at least partially) - the peace, joy, and fellowship with God that will come in the afterlife can be experienced now, in this world of hate and suffering...

Or maybe I'm just an idiot who needs to keep his mouth shut..:p
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i think the kingdom of God,
kingdom of heaven
and eternal life
are 3 distinct and different terms, but they intertwine each other in different parts of time and and individuals lives. it is hard to see it as a whole unless we take more scripture about them.

I think what you are saying in part is true Knight. But I am also seeing some people today trying to say that EGO and the inner man (soul) is God (like in New Age)...thus confusing the whole truth and that God is A SPIRIT, seperate from man, wanting to commune with us and guide us.

So some are having a Buddahist inner man experience, and thinking that is all there is to it. I think some are getting inner man emotion mixed up with the spirit of God too. But there is no doubt that Gods peace and joy does effect what we feel...sometimes there may even be conviciton.

:) You have a lot faith Knight and you know the scriptures well and I enjoy your postings.
 
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