Where was Eden, and does it matter?

Discussion in 'Ancient History and Mythology' started by eprom, Apr 8, 2005.

  1. queenofsheba

    queenofsheba New Member

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    Interesting: the word "paradise" derives from the Ancient Persian "para-daidos". It means "surrounded by walls" and refers to the Persian gardens. However, if I recall well, the word paradise is never used in Genesis?

    Theory about the snake: this is a typical myth in the style of "how did the animals get their shape?". The snake is punished by having to crawl in the sand for eternity.

    There were two trees: the Tree of Life and the Tree of Knowledge. Unfortunately, Eve ate from the wrong one, so we are still mortal, but we have a lot of knowledge.
     
  2. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    We were forbidden from eating of the tree in the center of the garden (knowledge). It is only after that, that we were sent from the garden before we could eat from the tree of life. Knowledge didn't teach us right from wrong, it taught us something more sinister...good and evil. I think this is a big difference.

    For example, It is right to eat, but wrong (or unwise) to over stuff one's self with food. This makes for a very unpleasant aftermath. It is good to provide meat and skins for one's family, but it is evil to take life for the pleasure of it (trophy hunting).

    just a thought.

    v/r

    Q
     
  3. Rouge47

    Rouge47 Follower of Christ

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    I know that the Cromagnon(Man) pushed out the Neanderthal Race when they began to populate southern France and other territory above the Mediterranian Sea(big word; can't spell it:p) They(we; man) came from around Central Africa and moved up. So could the Garden of Eden be there? After all it is rich in fertility down there. It would make a perfect garden to me.

    PJ
     
  4. InquisitiveInHalifax

    InquisitiveInHalifax New Member

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    In the gnostic teachings Eve ate from the tree of knowledge to awaken mankind, that we had to be awakened and go through all that we have and will in order to reach enlightenment.

    In the Da Vinci Code by Dan Brown (reading that is what eventually lead me here) it is pointed out that the apple is ripe, pun intended (lol), with symbols of the divine feminine. When cut in half the core of an apple reveals the shape of a five-pointed star (pentagram) which is the path that the planet venus travels through our night-sky. The apple that Eve is traditionally shown eating is also red in colour with the five sides or parts similar to the female genitalia!

    I know this has little to do with where the Garden of Eden is or if it even exists but I thought it was too interesting not to share. And I'm tired of carrying the burden of original sin.

    I really enjoyed what ProphetSmurf had discussed regarding all of the examples of a divine mother and child in so many different religions throughout history. I'd noticed the same thing but didn't know as many examples as that!:cool:
     
  5. mee

    mee Interfaith Forums

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    (E´den) [Pleasure]
    A region in which the Creator planted a gardenlike park as the original home of the first human pair. The statement that the garden was "in Eden, toward the east," apparently indicates that the garden occupied only a portion of the region called Eden. (Ge 2:8) However, the garden is thereafter called "the garden of Eden" (Ge 2:15) and, in later texts, is spoken of as "Eden, the garden of God" (Eze 28:13), and as "the garden of Jehovah."—Isa 51:3.​
    The Septuagint rendered the Hebrew word for "garden" (gan) by the Greek word pa·ra´dei·sos. To this fact we owe our association of the English word "paradise" with the garden of Eden.
    The original site of the garden of Eden is conjectural. The principal means of identifying its geographic location is the Bible’s description of the river "issuing out of Eden," which thereafter divided into four "heads," producing the rivers named as the Euphrates, Hiddekel, Pishon, and Gihon. (Ge 2:10-14) The Euphrates (Heb., Perath´) is well known, and "Hiddekel" is the name used for the Tigris in ancient inscriptions. (Compare also Da 10:4.) The other two rivers, the Pishon and the Gihon, however, are unidentified.
    The traditional location for the garden of Eden has long been suggested to have been a mountainous area some 225 km (140 mi) SW of Mount Ararat and a few kilometers S of Lake Van, in the eastern part of modern Turkey. That Eden may have been surrounded by some natural barrier, such as mountains, could be suggested by the fact that cherubs are stated to have been stationed only at the E of the garden, from which point Adam and Eve made their exit.—Ge 3:24.
     
  6. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Not quite correct. They are identified in satellite photos, they just happened to be dry river beds now. Apparently this puts Eden dead smack in the middle of the area of Old Babylon...
     
  7. Tao_Equus

    Tao_Equus Interfaith Forums

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    Actually you are all wrong. The garden of Eden was actually originaly the garden of Edin and was right here where I live in Edin-burgh, Scotland.
    The 4 rivers are the river almond, (proof that at one time groves of trees more associated with mediterranian climate once grew here), the Water of Lieth, (or water of life), the Braid Burn and the river Esk.

    Thought everybody knew that :p

    He he he he

    david
     
  8. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Edinburgh would be a good place to have God's garden...;)
     
  9. Tao_Equus

    Tao_Equus Interfaith Forums

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    Yeh, I have visited many many cities, very few come close to comparing to Edinburgh's beauty. have you been here?


    David
     
  10. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Not me sir (unfortunately), but my parents did, for a long vacation...;)

    They said it was good to be back "home", where family originated. (the islands)
     
  11. Tao_Equus

    Tao_Equus Interfaith Forums

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    well all you need is a cheap flight, my home is your home :)
     
  12. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Thank you much for your graciousness!

    I am much obliged.

    v/r

    Q
     
  13. mee

    mee Interfaith Forums

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    :D
     
  14. Azure24

    Azure24 New Member

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    Correct me if i'm wrong but reading Genisis i remember thinking that the Garden of Eden was not on earth. If indeed, i am wrong and Eden was on earth then how can earth(imperfect) contain paradise(perfect)?
     
  15. Alvis Rofhessa

    Alvis Rofhessa New Member

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    It seems to have been pretty much unanimously taken for granted that because 2 of the rivers of Eden (the Tigris and the Euphrates) are names of rivers in Iraq, that the biblical Garden of Eden is located either at the source or mouth of these 2 rivers, while the [Gihon or Pison] is arbitrarily identified with an ex Arabian river west of the Euphrates meeting towards south, and the [Pison or Gihon] is arbitrarily identified with an Elamite river east of Tigris meeting towards south. (The Gihon has also alt been connected with the Ceyhan/Seyhan to west of Euphrates diverging from it in north, or with the Nile, or else with the Euphrates which was also called by the name; and the Pishon has sometimes been identified with the [Indus/Ganges], or Seyhan.)

    However, as pointed out in some of your previous posts there are some difficulties with this:

    1 - It is possible that the Great Flood could have drastically altered the surface features of the Earth wiping out all traces of the rivers of Eden;

    2 - The Tigris and Euphrates don't share a common source, &/or they didn't meet when the ancient gulf used to extend further north upto Ur, &/or in ice age the gulf was dry land;

    3 - No definate proof of identification of the other (2) river(s) Pison (& Gihon);

    (4 - Dilmun was in the north not Bahrein, &/or Dilmun ("Bahrein") is not at mouth or source of rivers.)

    Moreover, somewhile ago I discovered a possible alternative theory of my own. A picture of the 4 rivers of Eden in Philipot uses the symbol of a circle with a cross in it ("sun wheel", note the CROSS? (river/blood)) which implies that the rivers were global/world sized rivers dividing the whole earth, which disqualifies the Euphrates/Tigris/Nile/etc as a glance at an atlas will show they are small-local not crossing continents (though there are said to be traces of lots of rivers under the Sahara desert). But then a glance at maps of the stages of the continental "drift" do show global/continental sized "rivers" dividing Pangaea along/between the edges of the future continents, suggesting the possibility that the continents may have split up (&/or come together) along the rivers of Eden, the rivers widening into oceans. (As-syria could then be Asia-Euros?) In ancient sources the borders of Europe, Asia and Libya/Africa were defined by rivers, (and in the Bible the borders of prophetic Israel are the Euphrates & Nile.) The ancients considered the seas/oceans as parts of 1 RIVER Oceanus.

    Furthermore I have also found the Genesis account of the 4 rivers of Paradise in a number of mythologies around the world, confirming the historicity of both. The combination of the biblical and mythological gives a fuller picture, and seemingly strengthens my theory (esp some like the Aztec, Babylonian, Chinese).
    -Judaeo-Xtian version: 4 rivers of Eden/paradise divide whole earth (ref: Philipot).
    -Norse version: 4 streams Ymir/Audhumla (refs: JC Cooper.)
    -Sumer-Akkad version: 4 rivers Karduniyash (T, E, Surappi, Ukni); 4 rivers Dilmun; "To water the 4 regions of the earth" (refs: A Heidel, .)
    -Chinese version: Kun-lun source of 4 great rivers which flowed in 4 directions (ref Larousse.)
    (-Indian version: 4 rivers Meru?)
    -Aegean version: 4 rivers Thera.
    -Aztec version: Tonacatecuhtli drove 4 roads thru centre of earth after cataclysm to disperse flood waters of the deluge (ref: M Jordan.)
    -Peru: Cuzco 4 parts/divs.
    -Navaho: In the age of beginning 4 streams flowed from the earth's center to the 4 cardinal points.
    -Egyptian: Nile comes from core of earth.
     
  16. flowperson

    flowperson Oannes

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    My opinion is that Eden is in Central Illinois.

    And, no, I don't believe that it matters.

    flow....:cool:
     

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