Is the Roman Catholic Church the Beast Prophesied about in Revalation?

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shepard

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"And the dragon gave him his power, and his seat,, and great authority." Revelation 13:2.Emperor Justinian "gave" Rome to the Pope when he decreed that the Pope should be over all theChristian churches of the earth, and established the Papacy in 538 A.D.
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Well I have nothing against any of our Christian relatives however politics is one thing and religion is an other, often the people and even the religious ambassadors themselves get this wrong Other wise I'd still be pissed off about how the Catholics let the Ottomans take Constantinople and the capital of Christian church off us. There's no one in the world that can bring you closer to God then yourself. The only thing Christianity says is that Jesus was divine and he was the son of God and that all the rest are false prophets. Did Jesus intend of creating a religion? However the greater part of Christianity is the whole theological view, which is one life and a judgment at the end of it, Heaven / Hell. Without this great theological view that Jesus taught us and the weight of evil in life and society, if it wasn't for this view further immorality would have been happening in the world. Hence why they say he came to save us and give his life.

 
"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads andten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy." Revelation13:1,2.​
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us -'Thus he said, the fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth." Daniel 7:23.
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2) This beast comes up out of the "sea." When a beast arises from the "sea," it always represents apower rising in a highly populated area; amid "peoples, multitudes, and nations, and tongues." Revelation
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17:15. It would have to conquer the existing government.
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3) This beast has seven heads and ten horns. A head represents the headquarters of a government. Thehead of a county is called the "county seat" you remember.
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A "horn" represents a king, a ruler. "And ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise."
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Daniel 7:24. The beast is a power with a man at the head of it. You'll find that the Bible explains itself!
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4) The beast has "the name of blasphemy' (Rev. 13:1).
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What is blasphemy?
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Again the Bible gives its own definition. In John 10:32,33, it tells how the Jews were going to stone Jesus. He asked them why they were about to stone Him and they said, "For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God."Amazing! Blasphemy is for a man to claim to be God! Of .course Jesus didn't blaspheme because Heis God. But for someone less than God it would be.​
But for anyone less than God to claim to forgive sins it's blasphemy.Concerning the beast it says, "and upon his heads the name of blasphemy." Revelation 13:1. The very leaders of this power would both claim to be God on the earth, and claim to have power to forgive men's sins!
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5) "and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority." Revelation 13:2. It's clear that the beast gets its "seat" and "authority" from the dragon. But who's the dragon? Here it is. "And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil and Satan, and bound him a thousand years." Revelation 20:2. The dragon is Satan. But there's more,"And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. And she brought forth a man child,who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to histhrone." Revelation 12:3-5.​
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Who is this beast?​
 
Postmaster said:
Well I have nothing against any of our Christian relatives however politics is one thing and religion is an other, often the people and even the religious ambassadors themselves get this wrong Other wise I'd still be pissed off about how the Catholics let the Ottomans take Constantinople and the capital of Christian church off us. There's no one in the world that can bring you closer to God then yourself. The only thing Christianity says is that Jesus was divine and he was the son of God and that all the rest are false prophets. Did Jesus intend of creating a religion? However the greater part of Christianity is the whole theological view, which is one life and a judgment at the end of it, Heaven / Hell. Without this great theological view that Jesus taught us and the weight of evil in life and society, if it wasn't for this view further immorality would have been happening in the world. Hence why they say he came to save us and give his life.
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This was all prophisied if we examine Revelations closely, I have been studing it and I am merely trying to shed light on this subject.
 
This light was brought to my attention, through my studies and I must share it.

It has characteristics of the four beasts (nations) which existed before it. Look carefully."And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and hismouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority."Revelation 13:2.
What nations are these? Again, the Bible tells us. The same four beasts are found in Daniel 7. 'These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth." Daniel 7:17. These are the four world empires, ruling consecutively from the time of Daniel down to the time of the fall of Rome. They are Babylon (605 - 538 B.C.), Medo-Persia (538 - 331 B.C.), Greece (331 - 168 B.C.), and Rome (168 B.C. - 476 A.D.). Now let's get the full description of these in Daniel 7.



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"Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold,, the four winds of the heaven stroveupon the great sea. And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another."The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and itwas lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it. And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh. After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it. After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. I considered the horns, and behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things."Daniel 7:2-8.


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I thank you shepard for posting this question, for book of Revalation has been of great intrest to me. I am very intrested as to how this all adds up to the Roman Catholic Church.
 
I do not believe that the Roman Catholic Church is the beast but I believe that the Pope during the tribulation will be the false prophet...I have the belief that the beast will be apart of the EU.
 

Here they are, beginning with Daniel's day.

The Lion - Babylon, The Bear - Medo-Persia, The Leopard - Greece. The Terrible Beast - Rome.

Lets Examine each one:

Babylon, represented by the two-winged lion, ruled the world when Daniel was alive. In the ruins of ancient Babylon, broken statues of lions with two wings can still be seen in modern times.The lion - a fit symbol of Babylon. It was the greatest of all the ancient kingdoms. The two wings tel lus of the swiftness in which the "golden kingdom" conquered the civilized world of that time.

What about the next kingdom?

Medo-Persia took over on that terrible night when King Belshazzar, the last king of Babylon, halfdrunk, threw a party for a thousand of his lords and tossed the sacred vessels from the temple of God about the floor. That was the last straw. His knees knocked together in fear as he watched a bloodlesshand trace his doom upon the palace wall.

"And this," Daniel declared, "is the writing that was written, MENE,MENE, TEKEL, UP HARSIN. This is the interpretation of the thing: MENE: God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it, TEKELE Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting. PERES:Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians." Daniel 5:25-28.

"In that night was Belshazzar the king of the,Chaldeans slain. And Darius the Median took the kingdom,being about three score and two years old." Daniel 5:30,31.

The two-winged lion was dead. The year - 538 B.C. Medo- Persia under Darius had taken over right on schedule! The bear of Daniel's dream had conquered the world. How is the "beast" of Revelation 13 like Medo-Persia?

It was a rule with the Medo-Persians that once they made a law - it stuck, and could never be reversed. The government was considered infallible. You'll see shortly that the "beast" power takes this same policy.

It was October 1, 331 B.C. At the head of his armies Alexander met the Persian forces head on and defeated them in the battle of Arbela. His military genius made Greece to emerge as the third worldempire.T he leopard with four heads and four wings of Daniel's vision had replaced the Medo-Persian bear.But why the four heads?

Alexander died with a raging fever at the age of 33.

The year 323 B.C.

His will had declared that the kingdom should go "to the strongest." His four generals, Cassander, Lysimachus, Seleuchus and Ptolomy took over the empire and divided it into four parts. These divisionsare represented by the four heads of the leopard beast.What about the four wings? They represent swiftness. Greece had conquered the world -in only 13 years. Such a feat has never been equaled.

(For more information on the four divisions of Greece, see Funk and Wagnell's New Encyclopedia on"Alexander III," pg. 390,391)

Who is the fourth "terrible" beast of Daniel 7?

"After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: ... and it had ten horns." "The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth."

Daniel 7:7,23. The fourth kingdom, represented by this terrible beast is Rome. Rome conquered Greece in 168 B.C.and eventually gave its power to the "beast" of Revelation 13. Out of the fourth "terrible beast" comes a "little horn." Now here's something amazing. The beast of Revelation 13, and the "little horn" of Daniel 7, are one and the same power!

God wants to make sure that there's no mistaking who this power is, so He describes it in both prophetic books.




 
Faithful Servant I respect your veiws but the Bible makes it plain.






The next clue as to who the beast is, is the time period which God gives for its reign before it receives its "deadly wound." It would reign for 1260 years. Just so there's no mistake on this, He repeats this period seven times in Daniel and Revelation!​





The seven verses mentioning the 1260 year time period are all speaking of the same power which persecutes God's people. These texts are as follows: Revelation 13:5, Revelation 11:2, Daniel 7:25, Revelation 12:14, Revelation 11:3, Revelation 12:6 and Daniel 12:7.​
The key that unlocks the time prophecies is the principle given in Ezekiel 4:6 and Numbers 14:34.

These verses reveal to us that one day in prophecy equals one literal year. For this reason all time prophecies must be first broken down into days. Using this Bible "key," time prophecies work out perfectly and become easy to understand.​
A month in Bible reckoning contains 30 days. A year contains 360 days. This is the formula for understanding all prophetic time.

In Revelation 11:2 and 12:14, the time given is "time," "times," and "half a time." This equals 3-1/2 times. From Daniel 4 we learn that a "time" equals one literal year. In that chapter you'll find that King Nebuchadnezzar lost his mind as Daniel predicted, and crawled around in the field for & is seven times." He was in that condition for 7 literal years. So 3-1/2 times equals 3/2 years (3-1/2 years contain 1260 days). Revelation 11:3 and 12:6 plainly give the time as 1260 days (that the beast would persecute God's people). Using the day for a year principle found in Ezekiel 4:6 and Numbers 14:34, we see that this power would rule for 1260 years before receiving its "deadly wound." When we take a look at the beast power, we see that this is exactly what has happened. For God to repeat this time period seven times like this shows the importance which He places on it.​

Here are the verses in sequence: Revelation 11:2 and 13:5 describe this power as reigning for 42 months - (42 months with 30 days to a month contain 1260 days.) Daniel 7:25 and 12:7, and Revelation 12:14 describe the beast as reigning 3-1/2 "times," or years - (3-1/2 prophetic years also contain 1260 days.) Revelation 11:3 and 12:6 describe this persecuting power as reigning 1260 days.All seven texts describe this power as reigning 1260 prophetic days which is 1260 literal years.​

 
Faithfulservant said:
I do not believe that the Roman Catholic Church is the beast but I believe that the Pope during the tribulation will be the false prophet...I have the belief that the beast will be apart of the EU.
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What is the EU?
 
Now who is the "beast?"

It's not only the same as the "little horn" of Daniel 7, but it's also the same power as the great whore riding upon the scarlet colored beast of Revelation 17. Let's take a shocking glimpse.
"And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgement of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters: ... and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns." Revelation 17:1-3.
There are those heads and horns again. We've come to associate them with Rome. The Harlot is controlling Rome riding it around - making her seat on it. Familiar isn't it! Now it gets even clearer. This "harlot" represents a corrupt church system. And get this "And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls. "Revelation 17:4.

It's a rich church.

A woman in Bible prophecy represents a church. God likens His people to a "comely and delicate woman." Jeremiah 6:2. A virgin is God's pure church. A harlot (whore) is a corrupt church.
She's called 'THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH." Revelation17:5. It's not only a church, it's a mother church. It's a world power.
"And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her I wondered with great admiration.' Revelation 17:6. Oh yes! It kills the saints!

This is shocking. Why would our heavenly Father Who is so loving and kind talk this way about achurch, of all things, and expose it to the world? Why does He Who is so full of pity and love warn anyone who even follows this power and receives its mark that they will end up in the lake of fire?I believe the answer is - because it's true. Though God is very tender hearted, He always tells the truth. I know it's shocking, but here's a corrupt church power that Satan has used to deceive the whole worldand rob men and women of their eternal life by using deception. Like Nimrod and Alexander theGreat, this power has leaders who divert the attention and worship of the people from the true, livingGod, to themselves.


These leaders turn people from heeding the word of God to heeding their word; from obeying the commandments of God, to obeying their commandments. This is why God tells it like it is - because He is love. And remember, there are many sincere, lovely Christians in this fallen church, named "Babylon," and they will hear God's call and come out. Look at this! "And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird." "And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, thatye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities." Revelation 18:2,4.
Now who is the "beast?" What power:
 
Now who is the "beast?" What power:
1) Received its "seat" and authority from Rome. Revelation 13:4.
2) Rules the world for 1260 years (from 538 A.D. - 1798 A.D.),
3) Then received a "deadly wound!' which later heals. Revelation 13:3.
4) Is both a political and a religious power, which is worshiped. Revelation 13:4.
5) Tampered with God's law. Daniel 7:25.
6) Has a leader who claims to be God on the earth and to be able to forgive sins. (which is blasphemy)
Revelation 13: 1.
7) Is a mother church (daughters have come out of her). Revelation 17:5.
8) Made war with the saints. Revelation 13:7.
9) Is a world power which is wondered at. Revelation 13:3,4.
10) Has "a man" at the head of it with the number of his name being 666. Revelation 13:18.
11) Has a dreaded "mark" which, if received, will cause a person to be cast into the lake of fire and lose
eternal life. Revelation 14:9,10.
Who is the only power on the face of the earth that fits all of the Bible characteristics for it. Is it the papacy?
But what about 666?
 
Let's take a close look at this thing to make sure there's no mistake,

"And the dragon gave him his power, and his seat,, and great authority." Revelation 13:2. Emperor Justinian "gave" Rome to the Pope when he decreed that the Pope should be over all the Christian churches of the earth, and established the Papacy in 538 A.D., when the Emperor's general Belisarius drove the Ostrogoths from Rome. Rome gave him his "seat." Bible prophecy predicted it hundreds of years before it happened! From 538 A.D. the Papacy ruled for exactly 1260 years, until 1798 when something incredible happened. The Pope was taken prisoner! Napoleon's general, Berthier, captured the Pope and took him to France! A deadly wound. The Papacy had reigned exactly 1260 years. Could it have just been coincidence?

"... and his deadly wound was healed; and all the world wondered after the beast." Revelation 13:3.​
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"In 1929, the Italian government recognized Vatican City as an independent state. Once again,the Pope was king. On March 9, 1929, he said, 'The peoples of the entire world are with us.' The San Francisco Chronicle published an account of the pact-signing on the front page of its newspaper. It actually read like this, 'Mussolini and Gaspari Sign Historic Pact . . . Heal Wound of
Many Years.' That is fantastic! The Bible prophesied that its wound would be healed and thenewspaper confirmed it in the exact same words." Stringfellow, Bill ALL IN THE NAME OF THE LORD, (Clermont: Concerned Publications, 1981), p. 124.​
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But look at this shocker. It says that the beast has "the name of blasphemy." Revelation 13:1. "It became one of the leading doctrines of the church that its visible head is invested with supreme authorityover bishops and pastors in all parts of the world. More than this, he took the very name of God! Hewas addressed as "Lord God the Pope" and declared to be "infallible."​
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What about 666? Let's take a shocking look.
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On the Pope's official mitre is the title "Vicarius Filii Dei," which means "Vicar of the Son of God."The claim that this is his official title has been stated publicly through the years.​
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In Revelation 13:18 it says, "Count the number of the beast; for it is the number of a man; and hisnumber is Six hundred threescore and six. (666)."​
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VICARIUS + FILII + DEI = 666

V = 5

I = 1

C = 100

A = 0

R = 0

I = 1

U = 5

S = 0


F = 0
I = 1

L = 50

I = 1

I = 1


D = 500
E = 0

I = 1

666

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I've seen all of this before and there's a flip side to all of it. The funny thing about "prophecies" is that they are usually so vague that with a little sophistry they can be applied to just about anything. I recommend looking at both sides of this before buying it. Just off the top of my head, I can tell you that there was no end to the Catholic regime at the hands of Napoleon in 1798 when the "Republic of Rome" was temporarily declared. Anyone who doubts that can go to a travel agent today and see if they can book a vacation to see the Sistene Chapel in the "Republic of Rome."

Anyone wanting to put "666" on something will give lists of things involving "6"s or anything related to a "6". Since there's only ten digits, it's pretty easy to find three "6"s if one wants to call something the "Beast." You'll see unsupported statements like the "recognized" meanings of certain symbolism, etc.

The prophecies of Daniel were probably written around 167 BCE and were largely "fulfilled" (with a few errors) by the time they were written - thus they were history, not prophecy. Although nobody really knows, my opinion, given the time of its writing and the symbolism used, is that the Revelation is a polemic against the excesses of the Roman Empire and that the Empire is the "Beast."
 
I guess I'm in the minority here who thinks that Revelation is referring to a timeless prophesy about the triumph of the Kingdom of God. I think that as Abdogado said, the details of Revelation probably come out of history, referring to Rome. But we can apply the lessons of Revelation to any situation in which a dominating empire persues oppression and greed instead of doing its level best to persue justice and charity. To me the point is that there is a reason to have hope and keep striving because the Kingdom of God will triumph. All these other predictions are just distractions from the task at hand, and worse, become a self-fulfilling prophesy of destruction and the basis for fear and hatred.


my 2 c
lunamoth
 
lunamoth said:
I guess I'm in the minority here who thinks that Revelation is referring to a timeless prophesy about the triumph of the Kingdom of God. I think that as Abdogado said, the details of Revelation probably come out of history, referring to Rome. But, we can apply the lessons of Revelation to any situation in which a dominating empire and persues oppression and greed instead of doing its level best to persue justice and charity. To me the point is that there is a reason to have hope and keep striving because the Kingdom of God will triumph. All these other predictions are just distractions from the task at hand, and worse, become a self-fulfilling prophesy of destruction and the basis for fear and hatred.


my 2 c
lunamoth
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Well said. I would agree with that.
 
Shepard I have read your post with great amazement. I cannot honestly see how one can sat Revalations is timeless propecy. This has been very inlighting to me, and I will study this to find the answers for my self. Some may try to dismiss it, but I have to say it makes alot of sense. Thank you! :)
 
ambassador said:
. I cannot honestly see how one can sat Revalations is timeless propecy.
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Dear ambassador,

By referring to Revelation as a timeless propehcy I do not mean that Revelation is not important or not relevant for believers today. I think it is more than relevant and its message is urgent for today. It is a real warning and its promise is sacred.

But, the question is not who what and when, but is my heart prepared now.

peace,
lunamoth
 
I couldn't agree more with you, lunamoth. Too often, we can forget that prophesy is not necessarily telling the future, but rather is bringing a message from God in symbolic vision.
 
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