Discussion in 'Ancient History and Mythology' started by iBrian, Nov 7, 2006.
Not worth it
Clearly this response does little to address my initial post.
Re: Not worth it
clearly you're not here for dialogue, but to tell us what idiots we are. enjoy your stay.
Come on, BB - lighten up.
Actually, moved this to the Ancient History board, as the discussion now seems most focused on the ancient roots of the Sabbath, rather than asking for Jewish perspective.
I'm going to mess things up and flatly say that there is a large Christian group that has NOT moved the Sabbath. That would be the "Eastern" Orthodox Church. Instead, in addition to "Sabbaton" (to transliterate the Greek), we have "Kyriake" (Lord's Day). However, both 7th and 1st days are to be honored.
Babylonia home of the astrologers!. sabbath = saturday = saturn = capricorn = grim reaper/time = 7th planet = 7 year cycles. sun day, made a holy day by Constantine, as Christians had distinquished themselves from the jews, particularly after the revolt around 130AD, but more pertinently because the sun/son was worshipped via Mithras, a mystery cult especially favoured by the roman army and imbued with astrological significance [where hot cross buns come from = cross of the cardinal points of the seasons therefore agricultural significance and Mithras was also a shepherd]. Christianity syncretised many of the mystery cults rituals/paraphrenelia as l imagine there was competition then as now to which one was the better one for salvation. Didn't they use the winter solstice as Christ's birthday for the same reason? Capricorn again, the father of the astrological chart as cancer is the mother at the summer solstice [ruling the moon].
This almost covers the whole thread.
Saturday was started because of the Saturnian Cults, and the Son worshippers founded the Sunday sabbath.
well yes generalising immensely you could say the move from lunar to solar was the move from goddess to god, matriarchal to patriarchal, concrete to abstract, soul to spirit, earth to cosmic was in human thought/evolution the rise of individuation out of tribalism. christianity was a manifestation of this through divinisation of the common man [as opposed to the usual kingly/elite] linked with godly incarnation [via greek/egyptian thought]. the sharing of concepts within the ambit of the mediterranean over millenia must have been immense. saturn was the outermost planet noted at that time hence its connotations of limit/death [is the devil/capricorn/pan in the tarot], until the 'transpersonal' planets were 'discovered'.
Sabbath is a derivative of the Hebrew word shabbat, meaning seventh. Saturday is physically the 7th day, thus the Sabbath day. Sunday was never considered "the Sabbath," but became the accepted day of worship when the Roman Catholic Church decreed it as such in the 6th Century.
As alluded to in some of the previous posts, the Christian Crusaders were returning from one of their various effort to rid the world of non-believers by spreading the word of Christian Love and Tolerance and killing anyone who did not concur, when they encountered a vastly superior army of sun worshipers. They knew they could not defeat them in battle, it would take weeks to go around them, so the Pope's emissary stuck a deal with them. In exchange for safe passage, the emissary agreed that they would change the day of worship from Saturday to Sunday in honor of their sun god. They agreed.
The Pope threw a fit when he learned of this, and was sure the people would never stand for it. The emissary assured him that we are the Holy Roman Catholic Church...who would DARE to defy us? So let it be done.
This all sounds like one of those "nice stories" that I would not normally give much credence, except for the fact that I read it for myself in a 1945 edition of the Catholic Home Companion, which is an official Church publication. If you doubt its authenticity, ask a Catholic Priest to explain it to you. They turn a lovely shade of gray when you corner them with the truth!
This all matter not! All days and every day is for the worship of G-d.
The Sabbath is one of the most talk about controversial topics, however the 7th day according to scripture is the Sabbath, as many are compelled to instruct many theory’s, claims or doctrines on how the Sabbath should be observed.
In Judaism according to Judaic law, Saturday is the 7th day Sabbath. Which on a large scale, the 7th day Adventist and many Messianic, Hebrew plus Israelite groups would agree.
It is knowned historical fact, that the origin of Saturday was named after a Roman god called “Dies Saturni”
It is also a scriptural fact that the Biblical Israelites observed a Hebrew Lunar calendar, which they have used to calculated the Sabbaths and holy feast days. New Moon in the Hebrew lunar calendar is the beginning of the month, as it was observed by many ancient civilization, including ancient Israel.
The calendar that we use in today’s modern society is the Roman Christian calendar which is no where mentioned in scripture, nor was it ever used by the Biblical Israelites. Upon comparing the Hebrew Lunar biblical calendar vs the Roman Christian calendar (Gregorian), It is evident that the weekly cycle upon both calendars are not identical.
The Julian/Gregorian which is a calendar that is inspired by Satan, does not constitute the New moon as the beginning of the month, as being that this was done on purpose. (Daniel 7:25)
The Sabbath law was given a few months after the Exodus period and during that particular time, the Roman Empire and the Roman Christian calendars did not exist, neither did the word Saturday or Dies Saturni. So upon knowing this fact, you would ask yourself. What calendar should the 7th day Sabbath should be calculated upon ? Should I calculate the 7th day Sabbath upon the Biblical Hebrew lunar calendar or the Roman Christian calendar that was inspired by Satan.
but HaDaSH *also* means new, as far as i'm aware - obviously "head-of" can mean new, too, but considering we have a rosh hodesh every month, i wouldn't have an issue with a "head of a head", as it were.
cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom etc. my diary whispers to me when i'm asleep about the fiendish purpose underpinning shrove tuesday, as well.
as for this idea that there was a switch from quarter-phase to strict 7-day, i'll check. i suppose it isn't entirely unfeasible, but i'd have to wonder when it took place.
Ouch that was not meant to be such a slap in the face, Juantoo3. I think there was some kind of running gag about sharks going on at the time, so I'm sure we were just kidding.
Actually going over this thread it seems I've been horrible to everyone I posted to! Diamond in the ruff, anyone?
Separate names with a comma.