INTRODUCTION New LC Member

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littledeer

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Hi, I'm posting to this group for the first time. I've been thirsting for something like this, and after an upsetting misunderstanding with an aquaintance, I've realized that I need to be around modern progressive Christians. God bless my Grandmother, who was of great faith yet from the old-fashioned and rather scary fundamentalist version. But her love of Christianity has stayed with me. I've encountered a lot of rabid anti-Christian hatred because of certain fundamentalist, hardcore groups and am finally trying to speak up and say that they do not speak for me, and for a lot of others either!
I read the Da Vinci code (ooh I hope there is a thread on that!), and although it was fiction (??), was very fascinated by the theories, concepts and history. I'm also interested in Biblical archaeology and learning more about the real lives of our Christian/Jewish ancestors. There are so many threads to go on, I thought I'd start here and will definitely read and post on some of the others. I started from Church of Christ to Methodist and now Unity Church. I'm also interested in Buddhism, as a philosphy to enhance my Christian faith. Anyway my main concern is Christianity gets a bad rap because of the more publicized evangelical versions, and it has hurt me personally. I made a simple comment like I am so sad that our religion has been so misinterpreted and someone totally went OFF on me, it was horrible. The person was already somewhat unstable but I had a pretty sleepless week anyway. So I have Gothic friends, some in Colorado Springs where some VERY conservative people have picked on them, who are Wiccan, agnostics etc. I have become close to a Wiccan friend, which is NOT an evil religion and he is not the one fighting with me. In fact we have understanding and respect for each other. But mostly, aside from Unity, I've been alone, and boy it's rough out there. I think we modern Christians need to speak up now, we are needed and take back our faith and apply it to today's world!
I try to respect all faiths but not fanatical. Our world needs HEALING and understanding. Perhaps one of my more "radical" thoughts is, and someone touched on something similar on the Twain thread, was that God expects and wants us to grow and change. Perhaps God is on a journey with us!! I think Jesus was sent by God to teach us and I love him and obviously find God a very significant force in my life.
Also, when I think of "Liberal" Christian, don't necessary mean politics, but might surprise you to hear I'm more of a Libertarian than straight Dem or Rep, though I've tried them all. Just personal. We can unite on many, many things and agree to disagree on others. I think it is our time. The fact that this thread exists give me hope. There's so much to talk about and I am SO GLAD I have found this group! Looking forward to meeting you all and reading more!

Sincerely,
Bambe'
PS !Hola!
 
littledeer said:
Hi, I'm posting to this group for the first time.
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Welcome aboard!

littledeer said:
I've been thirsting for something like this, and after an upsetting misunderstanding with an aquaintance, I've realized that I need to be around modern progressive Christians.
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Well I'm orthodox Roman Catholic, but as I'm reading modern philosophy along with Aristotle and Plato, I'm not sure whether that makes me 'old school' or not.

littledeer said:
God bless my Grandmother, who was of great faith yet from the old-fashioned and rather scary fundamentalist version. But her love of Christianity has stayed with me.
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It got through then ... she's not all bad! Remember she was probably from a generation where things were seen differently.

littledeer said:
I've encountered a lot of rabid anti-Christian hatred because of certain fundamentalist, hardcore groups and am finally trying to speak up and say that they do not speak for me, and for a lot of others either!
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Good for you.

littledeer said:
I read the Da Vinci code (ooh I hope there is a thread on that!), and although it was fiction (??),
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Don't be mistaken - it's a total fiction from start to finish.

littledeer said:
I was very fascinated by the theories, concepts and history. I'm also interested in Biblical archaeology and learning more about the real lives of our Christian/Jewish ancestors.
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Well, I can pitch in there from a Christian perspective. Bananabrain is well-informed on the Jewish side.

littledeer said:
I'm also interested in Buddhism, as a philosphy to enhance my Christian faith.
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Ooh, possibility of a big discussion there. The 'risk' is that we use Buddhism to rationalise what is essentially a Mystery ... and to use Buddhism properly means you have to be as fully informed about Biddhism as you are about Christianity ... that's a tall order!

Put from a catholic perspective, the Christian revelation is in no need of 'enhancement', although we might find Buddhist methodology 'enhances' our Christian practice ... but one has to acknowledge that at core, or in essence, Buddhism and Christianity contradict each other.

One says God cannot be known, the other says He can ...

littledeer said:
Anyway my main concern is Christianity gets a bad rap because of the more publicized evangelical versions, and it has hurt me personally.
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Tell me about it!

littledeer said:
So I have Gothic friends, some in Colorado Springs where some VERY conservative people have picked on them, who are Wiccan, agnostics etc. I have become close to a Wiccan friend, which is NOT an evil religion and he is not the one fighting with me. In fact we have understanding and respect for each other.
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Wicca is a nature religion, or makes a religion of nature – there's no intrinsic harm in that.

littledeer said:
I think we modern Christians need to speak up now, we are needed and take back our faith and apply it to today's world!
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That's what Catholicism is doing – but it tackles the issue at the very heart of the problem, which is the philosophical view of modernity.

littledeer said:
Our world needs HEALING and understanding.
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Trouble is, the medicine is not always palatable, especially when the patient actually enjoys his illness!

welcome aboard, Bambe

Pax,

Thomas
 
littledeer, welcome to the CR Forums. You are going to find such a rich and diverse group of individuals brimming with fresh ideas that I'm sure you will identify with kindred spirits such as yourself. If "radical" is what you want, radical you will get.

I do agree with much of what you've said, particularly with your comments concerning some of the fundamentalist mentality. I would consider myself fundamentalist myself, but not as radical and dogmatic as I used to be. Part of the change came when I decided to strip down what I learned about Christianity and start over. This time I approached my faith from a decidedly Jewish perspective and I sought to objectively study more thoroughly the Old Testament before entertaining what the New Testament held. That was rather difficult due to the strongholds of Christian thought still in my mind. But I learned so much from this approached that really turn my perspective of Christianity to new levels and I've gained so much appreciation of the jewish roots that founded the movement. I'm convinced that one cannot really grasp the New Testament without having a firm grasp on the Old Testament. And I think that is the problem with modern Christianity in general. If we approach it with a Gentile "churchanity" mind we are going to miss the essence of what Christ taught and much of the symbolism in what He did. He was called rabbi, afterall.

Anyway, I hope you will find you time here a growing and enlightening experience. Don't forget to look around in the other forums here. You'll find some fascinating stuff.

Just don't get caught in the headlights, littledeer.

Love & peace,

Dondi
 
Namaste bambe our new littledeer!

I visited the Unity Church in Colorado Springs a couple months ago, had a fantastic time! Loved the town, loved the church, wish I could have timed it so I could do the Sufi dances with them...another day.

There is also a Christ and Amida thread around, with some great links.

Welcome to CR, kick of your shoes, enjoy your stay...dive right in, the water is fine.
 
Welcome littledeer!

I know you'll find many stimulating discussions here.

Have fun!

Best regards,
Mark
 
Welcome littledeer. I'm the disaffected Twain guy & resident Christo-Buddhist.:D as to the latter, there's a very long history of fruitful interfaith dialogue between contemplatve Christians and Buddhists. An absolute ton of books written by Christian clerics on the blending of the two, (most by Catholic priests-couldn't help myself there Thomas;) ). Some of that dialogue is simply about finding common ground while some is about viewing Christian belief through Buddist lenses such as this site by an Episcopalean priest active in that dialogue, John Keenan:
Mahayana Theology

Another good site for that sort of insight run by a"liberal" Christian is: The Empty Bell

For a good look at a very old "Christian" contemplative practice known as the "prayer of the heart," see the link i gave to an article in a thread I started by that name in the liberal Christian forum.

Finally, I figure if you can't trust the nearly dead, who can you trust? I find the literature re near death experiences fascinating, (much of it generally supporting so-called "New Age" beliefs). The only Christian theology those expereinces seem to support is something called "Christian universalism." Here's a link to that discussion re to near-death experiences:

The Near-death experience and Christian Universalism - Ken Vincent

there, of course, is also an organization called the Center for Progressive Christianity: http://www.tcpc.org

Glad to have you aboard, earl
 
earl said:
Welcome littledeer. I'm the disaffected Twain guy & resident Christo-Buddhist.:D as to the latter, there's a very long history of fruitful interfaith dialogue between contemplatve Christians and Buddhists. An absolute ton of books written by Christian clerics on the blending of the two, (most by Catholic priests-couldn't help myself there Thomas;) ). Some of that dialogue is simply about finding common ground while some is about viewing Christian belief through Buddist lenses such as this site by an Episcopalean priest active in that dialogue, John Keenan:
Mahayana Theology

Another good site for that sort of insight run by a"liberal" Christian is: The Empty Bell

For a good look at a very old "Christian" contemplative practice known as the "prayer of the heart," see the link i gave to an article in a thread I started by that name in the liberal Christian forum.

Finally, I figure if you can't trust the nearly dead, who can you trust? I find the literature re near death experiences fascinating, (much of it generally supporting so-called "New Age" beliefs). The only Christian theology those expereinces seem to support is something called "Christian universalism." Here's a link to that discussion re to near-death experiences:

The Near-death experience and Christian Universalism - Ken Vincent

there, of course, is also an organization called the Center for Progressive Christianity: http://www.tcpc.org

Glad to have you aboard, earl
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Great links from our resident rabble-rouser! Thank you earl. :p
 
Yeehaw....you know it just dawned on me...

You might actually be not just the newest, but the first LC member...

I mean we are all members of CR and we post at our favorite most comfortable places and we all drift beyond our boundaries for exploration...

But you introduced yourself...on the LC forum...not in introductions and not just as new member...

But as a new LC member.

And funny as it is, while on this board and in most of the world...if I'm considered a Christian at all...it would be with the label Liberal or Progressive...but in my mind...I am a Conservative Christian...conserving Jesus teachings of love and oneness.
 
Hi Earl,

earl said:
there's a very long history of fruitful interfaith dialogue between contemplatve Christians and Buddhists. An absolute ton of books written by Christian clerics on the blending of the two, (most by Catholic priests-couldn't help myself there Thomas;)
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Hey, no problem! I've got "Christianity and the Doctrine of Non-Dualism" by 'a monk of the west' – showing the correlations between Christianity, Brahminism, Judeaism, Islam, Taoist, Buddhism ...

Check out 'my main man' at ZENIT - The World Seen From Rome, and read the Vatican Message to Buddhists: "May We Continue to Contribute Toward Peace and Harmony"!

Sorry for the aside, Littledeer, Earl and I go back a way ...

Thomas
 
Littledeer...Welcome to CR! You will find many seekers and kindred spirits here. Most of us are still looking for answers and are just trying "to be". I'm looking forward to your posts.

flow....:)
 
Hi Littledeer –

Looking back, I see I kicked off your welcome in my usual fashion, answering questions in perhaps a somewhat pointed manner. It's my style, it keeps me from outbursts of sentimentality! Didn't mean to lecture ...

... anyway ... here's an idle speculation:

If we think of homeopathic potencies, then to what degree is it possible to 'dilute' the human being, and that being still remain effectively and actively human?

Supposing, for example, we were one tenth the mass, one tenth the substance, one tenth the density (go with me here, physics was never a strong suit – Flowperson – where are you?).

Supposing we were like comets, the 'nearest thing to something not being there, but still there' – supposing our materiality was so fine that we were translucent ... perhaps we could even walk through walls, or on water ... or just float in the air ... am I making sense?

I don't mean suppose ourselves as angels, or suppose that we are immaterial, beings of pure essence or pure intellect ... I will not surrender humanity that easily ... but supposing the whole world, the whole Kosmos, was not quite as 'dense' nor 'solid' as it has become ... that we moved in and through everything ...

Suposing all nature was permeable ... and we all lived and moved in a common medium ... then supposing one element said "you don't understand, I want to savour what it is to be me, I want to see what it's like to be myself alone, not dependent on anyone or anything, under no obligations ... ('I need my space' as we say today) and in that moment the medium vanished, or snapped, and in a twickling everything was sudddenly contained in a 'skin', everything distinct and separate from everything else ... everything contained in its own space ...

... that's what sin does ... that's what sin is ... an isolation ...

Scripture says that fundamentally, we are good, in fact we are very good, and we knew it, but it wasn't enough, and in wanting more for ourselves we lost what we had in common with everything else ...

Tragically, in this modern era, 'self-image' is all important, and it's the very thing that caused the problem in the first place! If we really want to love, we have to learn that love is about giving all to another, not about ourselves ... real love gives and never counts the cost ...

... meanwhile we struggle ... and suffer ... just to be ... let alone find love ...

Just tinkering ...

Thomas
 
Thomas...Great tinkering. I'm here.

I believe that you are addressing certain uncertanties of the quantum nature of nature. Most of what we live in is composed of space both on the inside and outside. An infinite continuum if you will.

I first realized the profundity of looking at realities in these ways when I was a teen and attended a showing of the 1950's classic SciFi film, The Incredible Shrinking Man. If you can find it to rent or own do it. The closing speech by the shrunken man in his new reality alone is worth the effort.

Yes, I believe that one definition of sin would be isolation and separation...but science is such these days that it can and is sometimes artificially induced to make certain people believe falsely that they have sinned, when nothing of the sort is the case.

It is only the warped judgement, perspective, and faulty reasoning of others that can make it seem real. Through the loooking glass stuff. It's the sort of things being done in places like Guantanamo these days. Sooo... who are the sinners in such cases ?

flow....:cool:
 
flowperson said:
Sooo... who are the sinners in such cases ?
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I think there is a common trend to look at sin subjectively, and sentimentally, without going into the meaning of the doctrine as such ... people want to start looking for execptions to the rule, before they even understand what the rules say.

Sin, in baseline Catholic/Orthodox doctrine, is not a 'thing' so much as an absence ... so the measure of sin is the absence of good, rather than the acuality of the presence of something evil ... sin is a falling short ...

So the constant question is, "could we manage this better?" And then I think answers become apparent, but only when measured against a mean (otherwise, better than what?)

Christianity offers a paradigm, against which no man is perfect, but that is far from saying that all men are thereby damned.

Aquinas famously said, "no man wills evil, but man invariably wills a 'lesser good'."

Thomas
 
Thomas:

Thanks for your response, but you have turned your question around on its head. You were speaking of hidden things that have their basis in the physical nature of the universe, and I replied in that context.

I submit that you are making valid statements in your last post when person to person interactions are taken into account...the absence of good allows evil to assume precedence. However, in the realities of today's world and at the insistence of the powers that be that the vast majority of interpersonal relationships take place filtered through electromagnetic devices and systems, the ability of fewer and fewer individuals to amplify evil intent is automatically allowed to become more prevalent... since the entire transmission medium is hierarchically driven by monetary considerations. Because of this system and the power of the people "in charge" to conveniently demonize chosen victims, the scapegoating of innocents to cover the crimes of the powerful is allowed to continue virtually without limit or control by the citizens.

Sooo...I again pose the question, who are the sinners in such a scenario ?
Assuming that those who wish to interact on a purely person to person basis are the ones who seek to expand the "good" in society, how might that be effectively done given the media-driven realities of today's societies and the vast amounts of money that actions for change for the good automatically require. Person to person influence is about the only reality, aside from pain and suffering, in poorer sections of society, but all change in today's world seem to be required to be top down in nature. A conundrum that seems to be insurmountable to me.

flow....;)
 
Wow, some really thought provoking discussions in this introduction thread....but...um....what happened to littledeer? :confused:
 
Re: INTRODUCTION New LC Member - Update

Dondi said:
Wow, some really thought provoking discussions in this introduction thread....but...um....what happened to littledeer? :confused:
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Oh excuse me, I read Thomas's welcome and really appreciated it. I just got very busy for a while, inventory at work, then a little tired and lazy afterwards. It's supposed to be spring in Colorado but has been rather cold and rainy for the last two weeks. I am still here and very interested in what you all have to say. I've still had problems with a certain member of the Gothic community here in Denver, which I also let zap my energy but I should know better than not to let negative people do that. I get along famously with a Wiccan friend, so it's not so much people's faith, but their ATTITUDE. This seems like a tolerant and kind board, I'm fed up with people flipping out and yelling at each other on religious topics (it wasn't here but on a goth board). If I hadn't been so upset about it, I may not have come here, so maybe some good will come of it. Thanks to you all!
- Littledeer
 
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