flowperson
Oannes
Hey, she works out and Exxon named an oil tanker after her. What else could a girl want anyhow ?
flow....
flow....
Impeach CheneyBush
- Thread starter Pathless
- Start date
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
Paladin
Purchased Bewilderment
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
How much will we be spending to pay for the fiasco that is the Iraq War?
Arianna Huffington: The $3,000,000,000,000 War is a Domestic Issue - Politics on The Huffington Post
Huffington Post said:
Arianna Huffington: The $3,000,000,000,000 War is a Domestic Issue - Politics on The Huffington Post
Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste all, are we *sure* that the united states is anti muslim? seems that the actions of the united states are too varied to be narrowly understood in such terms given the recent events in the Balkans. not into the online petitions, Pathless, so i shall not be signing. if i don't like an elected official i don't vote for them when they run and i have confidence that my representatives represent my basic views. of course they can't represent my total views.. only i could do that but there it is. metta, ~v
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
This thread is not about the U.S. being "anti muslim." What I have stated in this thread is that the Iraq War and continuing occupation is an illegal war and occupation, an immoral war and occupation, and should be opposed on those grounds.
As for the Balkans, what recent events are you referring to? The secession of Kosovo from Serbia? This is another instance of heavy spin in the U.S. media. Look into it.
Jeremy Scahill said:
Full article: AlterNet: The Real Story Behind Kosovo's Independence
Vajradara said:
That is your prerogative, certainly. Personally, I don't think voting is enough, and I don't at all feel that my represntatives represent my basic views. So we differ in that respect, and I feel inclined to take civic engagement beyond the realm of voting and into redresses of grievances like petitions, micro personal political actions, and larger scale direct actions.
Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste Pathless,
thank you for the post.
hence i did not direct my comment to you specifically it was, however, mentioned in this thread that the United States is anti Islam and Muslim and hence my query.
what gives you the impression that i've not looked into it? my looking into it, however, has very little to do with what is happening in Kosovo as near as i can tell. your article writers' source for his claims of no genocide are here: WSJ.com - Page One Feature the article goes on to state that there are, at the time of printing, 1999, still 300 grave sites to check so it would seem a bit premature to come to such a conclusion. i am wondering what they found at the other grave sites, perhaps nothing at all. i'll have to continue researching to see if there is something more recent on this.
more tellingly, perhaps, it seems that the numbers of victims which were reported were done so by international news media rather than by the United States alone, so i would suggest that if the reporters had not been so eager to earn another Pulitzer Prize for reporting atrocities then there may have been a more balanced media representation.
of course reporters aggrandizing events is nothing unique to the United States media nor any media that i'm aware of, ratings don't ya know.
choose other representatives and perhaps they may. they are, of course, individual beings have have many competing influences.
metta,
~v
thank you for the post.
hence i did not direct my comment to you specifically it was, however, mentioned in this thread that the United States is anti Islam and Muslim and hence my query.
what gives you the impression that i've not looked into it? my looking into it, however, has very little to do with what is happening in Kosovo as near as i can tell. your article writers' source for his claims of no genocide are here: WSJ.com - Page One Feature the article goes on to state that there are, at the time of printing, 1999, still 300 grave sites to check so it would seem a bit premature to come to such a conclusion. i am wondering what they found at the other grave sites, perhaps nothing at all. i'll have to continue researching to see if there is something more recent on this.
more tellingly, perhaps, it seems that the numbers of victims which were reported were done so by international news media rather than by the United States alone, so i would suggest that if the reporters had not been so eager to earn another Pulitzer Prize for reporting atrocities then there may have been a more balanced media representation.
of course reporters aggrandizing events is nothing unique to the United States media nor any media that i'm aware of, ratings don't ya know.
choose other representatives and perhaps they may. they are, of course, individual beings have have many competing influences.
metta,
~v
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Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
Ah, I see now, Vajradhara. You were referring to this post by flow:
Not to be too much of a stickler, but it should be noted that "anti Muslim" and "anti Islam" were used by you to describe flow's critique, although he did not actually use those terms himself. But I see your point now.
I'm not sure, as you didn't provide a lot of information to begin with about "recent events in the Balkans." I was trying to clarify what you were talking about and, yes, assuming that you had heard the triumphant reports from U.S. media outlets that glorified the independence of Kosovo and its subsequent celebrated changeover to Kosova.
Ad Nauseum indeed. I tend to see a cyclical pattern to some world events.
Goebbels was Hitler's minister of propaganda and beginning in the 1930's he devised a scapegoat propaganda campaign against the Jews which ended with all too predictable results.
Now, seventy years later I see a great parallel in what has been done in the last two decades with regard to Muslims. It has intensified the past eight years with predictable results. I'm not saying that any one person is responsible for the "punish the Muslims because they're different" campaign. But this has certainly gone on with events in the Balkans, Kuwait, and Iraq, and still may in Iran. In our times it is the interaction between the U.S.'s political leadership and the corporate media which has facilitated the carnage.
BTW, seventy years before Goebbels and Hitler we had a minor uprising known as The U.S. Civil War.
flow....
Not to be too much of a stickler, but it should be noted that "anti Muslim" and "anti Islam" were used by you to describe flow's critique, although he did not actually use those terms himself.
But I see your point now.Vajradhara said:
I'm not sure, as you didn't provide a lot of information to begin with about "recent events in the Balkans." I was trying to clarify what you were talking about and, yes, assuming that you had heard the triumphant reports from U.S. media outlets that glorified the independence of Kosovo and its subsequent celebrated changeover to Kosova.
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
Further elucidation on this mind-boggling estimate:
AlterNet: War on Iraq: Cost of Iraq War Now Beyond Human Comprehension
William Hartung said:
Unfathomable stuff.
I was listening to the 3 trillion dollar war author. The most significant thing I heard was that 1993 was peak year for WWII spending. Yes that is right, with disability and veteran benefits and paying debt, it was 1993 that WWII cost the most...been downhill ever since.
Oh and forget Boeing and Lockheed Martin, we just contracted overseas for our next fleet of aircraft.
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
BBC NEWS | Business | Boeing loses out in $40bn US deal
Whatever company is making weapons, wherever they are making them, be they Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Northrup Gruman, KBR, or Tonka, they are engaging in war profiteering.
Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste Pathless,
thank you for the post.
i considered that the "recent events" part was narrow enough to be indicative of the ongoing process of independence happening in Kosovo.
are you suggesting that the only media in the entire world which have carried this story are based in the United States?!
metta,
~v
thank you for the post.
Pathless said:
i considered that the "recent events" part was narrow enough to be indicative of the ongoing process of independence happening in Kosovo.
are you suggesting that the only media in the entire world which have carried this story are based in the United States?!
metta,
~v
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
No, and I think you know that's not what I was "suggesting." I was operating on the assumption that we are both United States citizens and are especially vulnerable to the overwhelming corporate media in this country, which is often the first source of news. I apologize for apparently insulting your integrity by my assumptions, but you should realize that you didn't give me much to go on. And so I made assumptions. My bad.
Pathless
Fiercely Interdependent
Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste Pathless,
thank you for the post.
well... i am not able to discern your intentions just read your words, as it were, and thus far in this discussion it seems that your focus is solely upon the United States media and the poor job they have done in using this story to boost their ratings.
i try to consume a variety of news sources so that i can, to the extent which i'm able, come to a balanced view of any particular subject.
it's true, i'm afraid, i tend to be sparse in many of my posts and that does create some communication issues.. but no, you didn't offend me at all i was just surprised that you seemed to have ignored the rest of the world media in their, equal, zeal.
metta,
~v
thank you for the post.
well... i am not able to discern your intentions just read your words, as it were, and thus far in this discussion it seems that your focus is solely upon the United States media and the poor job they have done in using this story to boost their ratings.
i try to consume a variety of news sources so that i can, to the extent which i'm able, come to a balanced view of any particular subject.
it's true, i'm afraid, i tend to be sparse in many of my posts and that does create some communication issues.. but no, you didn't offend me at all
i was just surprised that you seemed to have ignored the rest of the world media in their, equal, zeal.metta,
~v
Paladin
Purchased Bewilderment
Pathless, here is another look at Kosovo, don't know if you have spotted this as yet but it seems to go together with the alternet article.
Kosovo: The US and the EU support a Political Process linked to Organized Crime