The Link

[citizenzen]

Who Is Ida?

"Ida is a 47 million year old, perfectly preserved primate recovered from the Messel Pit in Germany.

Ida is the most complete early primate fossil ever found, and scientists believe that she could be one of our earliest ancestors. She is a remarkable link between the first primates and modern humans and despite having lived 47 million years ago, her features show striking similarities to our own."

Thoughts?

 

[wil]

Who Is Ida?

"Ida is a 47 million year old, perfectly preserved primate recovered from the Messel Pit in Germany.

Ida is the most complete early primate fossil ever found, and scientists believe that she could be one of our earliest ancestors. She is a remarkable link between the first primates and modern humans and despite having lived 47 million years ago, her features show striking similarities to our own."

Thoughts?

Amazing marketing is my thought. I was sitting in a bar and saw it hyped on a couple different news channels (no sound, but some interviews and fossil pix) thought it was something new...

The book, the movie, the website released simultaneously.

"It will be in every text book...."

yup there is gonna be some money made on this.

and just toss around missing link and primate ancestor and you are gonna get the pastors thumpin away like a kangaroo with an itch...which means what...more free publicity.

 

[nativeastral]

she might show a striking similarity to you! we look like lemurs

seriously, anything Attenburgh talks about l'm all ears

47 million years -wow- cant get my head around that; seems we are still in primary school the way we sometimes behave rather than the uni versity of life.

 

[citizenzen]

and just toss around missing link and primate ancestor and you are gonna get the pastors thumpin away like a kangaroo with an itch...which means what...more free publicity.

It also means increased scrutiny.

You might make some money, but you also might ruin a number of careers.

While I'm a little taken aback that a major motion picture is coming out so soon, I have to believe that the people a smart enough to have the goods to back it up.

But we shall see.

 

[seattlegal]

It also means increased scrutiny.

You might make some money, but you also might ruin a number of careers.

While I'm a little taken aback that a major motion picture is coming out so soon, I have to believe that the people a smart enough to have the goods to back it up.

But we shall see.

Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ida_(fossil)
The fossil was found in 1983, and was bought for $1 million in 2006.
All this hoopla and publicity was planned.
Methinks it's a money making move, more than anything.

 

[Tao_Equus]

As fossils go they don't get much better than this one....a real beauty!!
Look forward to seeing the doc on Tuesday night.

 

[Snoopy]

Look forward to seeing the doc on Tuesday night.

ooh yes, just seen the trailer for it...


s.

 

[wil]

As fossils go they don't get much better than this one....a real beauty!!
Look forward to seeing the doc on Tuesday night.

What makes it so?

 

[juantoo3]

Unfortunately for me I don't get cable tv, so I will not get to see the show.

From what I did see, I have a few observations:

I think some people are getting ahead of themselves in the rush to "prove" the missing link.

I think it looks as much like a squirrel as anything, let alone lemur.

The fossil pit has been being mined for fossils for quite some time, are they quite certain of the age? 47 million is quite a long way back.

The opposable thumb issue may, or may not, be an accurate assessment. The bone may have been broken in the fossilization process. What is more is that if indeed this were a predecessor of modern apes, why would others in the ape family *revert* to non-opposable thumbs? Seems to me opposable thumbs would be a very late evolutionary trait to develop.

In short, I think it is much too soon to draw any conclusions. Too many people draw conclusions with crayons...might be OK hanging on the family refrigerator, but hardly worth hanging in an art gallery.

 

[Tao_Equus]

What makes it so?

Its condition and what it shows. Not just the complete skeleton but the impression of its fur and the remains of its last meal. These all make it a remarkable and rare find.

The show does not come out till Tuesday so I will defer comment on its importance as a "link" but from what I have seen so far this is not is what is being claimed.

 

[citizenzen]

I think some people are getting ahead of themselves in the rush to "prove" the missing link.

It's waaay too soon to call this conclusive. Scientists will be squabbling about this for years. Like any single discovery, it will require corroborative evidence before anybody could declare it "the missing link".

I think it looks as much like a squirrel as anything, let alone lemur.

Thank you for that keen observation, Dr. Science.

 

[juantoo3]

Thank you for that keen observation, Dr. Science.

Thank you for your lack of toleration for an observation.

 

[citizenzen]

Thank you for your lack of toleration for an observation.

I was plenty tolerant and even agreed with your first observation.

As for the squirrel, it was hard to tell if that was an observation or a joke. Frankly, if I were you, I'd stick with it being a joke. We'll all have a little chuckle and I'll buy the next round.

 

[wil]

Am I jaded somehow? Having seen a myriad of incredible fossils? The one that impressed me the most was a fossil within a fossil, a pregnant Iicthyasaur.

This whole debacle reminds me of the hype preceding the Blair Witch Project.

 

[Tao_Equus]

Am I jaded somehow? Having seen a myriad of incredible fossils? The one that impressed me the most was a fossil within a fossil, a pregnant Iicthyasaur.

This whole debacle reminds me of the hype preceding the Blair Witch Project.

Yeh there have been some amazing fossils but this is a 42million year old mammal. If you cannot recognise that as extra special then perhaps your days of being impressed are over ? Or perhaps it challenges some secretly cherished preconceptions ? I appreciate it is easy to get cynical about hype and the modern tendency to create a media circus around nothing very much at all. Yet this fossil clearly is special and I look forward to Tuesday nights program.

 

[wil]

What secretly cherished preconceptions could I be challenged by?

As was said earlier....

The fossil was found in 1983, and was bought for $1 million in 2006.

that makes discovered over quarter a century ago...bought a few years ago...we's got to make the investors a profit...somebody hire PT Barnum.

 

[Tao_Equus]

What secretly cherished preconceptions could I be challenged by?

Interesting question!! I think you are best placed to guess though

As was said earlier....that makes discovered over quarter a century ago...bought a few years ago...we's got to make the investors a profit...somebody hire PT Barnum.

I do not think a museum in Oslo is particularly interested in making a profit from it and I cannot imagine it being interested in selling it!!

After watching the David Attenburgh narrated documentary on the fossil I do see it as a crucial find. It seems it really could be a distant ancestor of humanity. That opinion rests crucially on a small bone in the foot that is almost identical to ours and is vital in the evolutionary ability to walk upright. It does appear to be the oldest "Eve" primate yet uncovered.

 

[wil]

What secretly cherished preconceptions could I be challenged by?.

Interesting question!! I think you are best placed to guess though

I do not think a museum in Oslo is particularly interested in making a profit from it

Oh my a museum not interested in making a profit?? I've not been around many of those... Even the Smithsonian would love to break even.

Now maybe I'll rephrase, which preoconceived notions would you think one would have to cause you to make the assertion?

Then I can easily tell you if they are amongst my myriad of baggage.

 

[iBrian]

So far as I'm aware, publicly funded bodies tend to refrain from trying to make a profit - because the moment they do become profitable to any degree, they lose access to funding.

Certainly used to be the case in the arts.

 

[path_of_one]

I think any well-preserved primate find is super neat. But I also think it is a sort of pop culture science to declare this or that "the link." Your average person seems to be rather misinformed about how evolution works and thinks there is some particular fossil out there that will be "the link" between this and that. That just ain't how evolution works- we have tons of links and I find that when they are all lined up one after another, even the most uninitiated student can see the progression of human evolution from Ardipithecus to Lucy and Co. to early Homo to us.

What really has been a fascinating find to me is the find in Indonesia of the "hobbit" humans-- that has implications for how the human brain works and assumptions about brain size as opposed to neurological wiring for higher cognitive functioning.

So far as I'm aware, publicly funded bodies tend to refrain from trying to make a profit - because the moment they do become profitable to any degree, they lose access to funding.

Certainly used to be the case in the arts.

Yep. And $1M is not very much for an acquisition of this sort.