a perspective on 2012

Discussion in 'Alternative' started by Jenn, Jan 5, 2010.

  1. Jenn

    Jenn New Member

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    I was sent this article by a friend from the Theosophical Society in England, which I thought might spark some interest/debate here.

    [FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]A Theosophical Approach To 2012
    Christian Bodhi

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    So what do you think? Do you agree/disagree?
     
  2. shawn

    shawn New Member

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    Now is always a good time to make the world a better place.
    If it takes 2012 to help an individual to make the effort, then great, as long as people find some kind of catalyst to inspire them.
     
  3. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Staff Member

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    The whole 2012 claim is based on a single book - The Mayan Prophecies - which makes it's argument as thus:

    1. We found some Mayan pictures and coloured them in
    2. We gave each colour a number, then added them up
    3. The number we got was a bit like another number for a solar year
    4. We found as there was x pictures, this must relate to x years, and came out as 2012
    5. This identified as the year the Mayans correctly predicted the end of the earth and all civilisation with it, because the Mayan's were really really good at making prophecies.
    6. All science is corrupt because it won't take our colouring-in method seriously

    Or something like that.

    A. Serious. Piece. Of. Junk.
     
  4. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    This I feel is a serious issue. The hysteria and folks taking advantage of same is going to do some damage...remember Y2K?? and that was only about computers...not the universe.
    Again I agree, logic must reign, it will be interesting to see how other religions take advantage of this situation.
    I love Eckardt Tolle's (obvious) line on this. You can not look to be enlightened in the future as enlightentment can only happen now.
    Again, Rev. Amalia Frank, when a man came to her door announcing boldly and loudly, "Sister I am here to be saved!", she replied, "Well you've come to the wrong place, around here you have to learn to save yourself."
    Appears I agree muchly.

    And then there is the quote of Charles Shultz, creator of Peanuts, Snoopy, Charlie Brown, Lucy et al.
     
  5. Nick the Pilot

    Nick the Pilot Well-Known Member

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    "...when a man came to her door announcing boldly and loudly, "Sister I am here to be saved!", she replied, "Well you've come to the wrong place, around here you have to learn to save yourself."

    --> Now that is a great quote.

    "...remember Y2K?? "

    --> I won a pretty good bet from my idiot friend who said total anarchy would result from Y2K!
     
  6. citizenzen

    citizenzen Custom User Title

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    nonsensical.

    In a nutshell.
     
  7. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    He still around?

    Can I get in on that action this time?

    One question...if anarchy rules do you have to honor bets?

    Another question, is anarchy ruling an oxymoron?

    Back to your regular programming.....


    It does not go unnoticed that I resonate with much I read from these theosophists...
     
  8. AndreG

    AndreG New Member

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    I agree, it reminds me of Isaac Asimovs Foundation series.

    We dont know if it is nonsense or not, why blow it off

    Daniel Pinchbeck has alot of great info on youtube and google video
    His website is very informative
    Reality Sandwich | Evolving consciousness, bite by bite.
     
  9. Jenn

    Jenn New Member

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    Although I agree fully with you on this, I don't think that is going to be the mass reaction.

    For the doom-sayers, it engenders a fatalistic belief in which they can hide and confirm all their dogmas and rigid expectations of others. I know for many fundamentalist 'born again' Christians, it merely makes them more determined to get as many people converted as possible ... and has little to do with a concern for making the world a better place. To them, they will be leaving the world, escaping it, so their intentions have nothing to do with evolving or growing as individuals and a species.

    For the others who think that everything is going to change instantly and become "higher" or "holier", etc ... this also can become a crutch or excuse for not making change *now*. I've talked with a number of individuals who think this and the result is usually that they have a very apathetic, non-engaged reaction to the world. They don't feel they have to "do" anything because all the work is going to be done for them.

    Those are the two ends of the spectrum. Of course there will be those individuals who, as you say, take the possibility of 2012 as a cue to carry on making the world a better place. A friend of mine thinks that it will be a "make or break" time, and we have to get to a certain level of maturity as a planet or else we won't be able to see/take the opportunity 2012 provides. So she is *very* concerned and feels immense pressure to do everything she can, in all aspects of her life, to grow and contribute to the world around her. Kudos to her and I think that is a positive reaction.

    I just don't think that the majority of people will be so balanced in reaction to that.

    For myself, I don't really feel concerned whether 2012 will happen or not. All I can do is carry on doing the best I can, in every way that I can, one day at a time. To think otherwise would be lies and a false understanding of myself and the world.
     
  10. nativeastral

    nativeastral fluffy future

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    yeh l would say 2012 has become a placeholder to which myths and ideas and prophecies has been attached to it, much like the new millennium; did anyone else get an anti climax on 01.01.00? [l think for me because 1999 was a high due to Princes' song!].

    but meaning and significance will be made and sought by those who consider dates and times meaningful according to what they have absorbed studied and accepted; no doubt if l was 100% into astrology l would be stating what planetary energies were going to be unleashed at that time and how it would effect humanity which could be synchronised with other belief systems if so desired, much like statistics can be made to fit certain theories.
     
  11. earl

    earl ?

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    Guess you could consider the New Agers expecting 2012 to mark a New Eden of spiritual insight in humanity as the cheerier antithesis of the fundamentalistic Christian notion of Apocalyptic times.:D Sometimes I see this camp referring to that new epoch as occurring due to a "thinning of the veil" between the spiritual and material worlds or as Jenn noted due to an increase in spiritual energies flowing into the world, whatever that means. I think many New Agers, being an optimistic bunch, are always expecting that spiritual awareness will markely increase just around the corner collectively. Thus a similar embrace by many New Agers in the dubious concept of "indigo" or "crystal" children-the notion that there are or will be increasing numbers of folk incarnating in the world with advanced spiritual and/or psychic abilities and awareness. Certainly, I've seen nothing to support that notion. But, as humanity has and will evolve physically over the millenia, one could wonder what psychological, cultural, or "spiritual" "mutations" might occur over further centuries or millenia. Who knows? But, overnight-quite doubtful. The concept of individual or collective spiritual evolution has always attracted New Agers and certainly the writer Ken Wilber has spent decades toying around with that notion himself, though he would not ascribe to the foregoing concepts. Like other posters here he would see whatever spiritual fruits of our labor occur will be just that -fruits of our labor as opposed to some gift simply dropped into our laps. But could there be a source of external "spiritual" assistance always there to assist those who are open to/willing to do the work? Again, who knows but in 1 way or another plenty of our current religious traditions have actually of course long taken that view in 1 form or another. earl
     
  12. shawn

    shawn New Member

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    To quote the bard (Jim Morrison):"The future is uncertain and the end is always near..."
    We go through lots of storms in life.
    Some very much worse than others.
    Thing is.....they all blow over and pass into memory.

    I agree that it is unlikely that there will be any kind of *mass* movement of the people in any concerted and positive direction.
    maybe I have become pessimistic, but the majority of people are very ignorant, and so very many are highly opinionated and closed minded, thinking they have true knowledge when all they have is speculation.
    I realize I have such flaws as well, so I am not looking down on the peasants in the trenches, so to speak.....I am just another peasant in the trenches.


    Looking at the astronomy side of this time, our solar system does move about within our galaxy, and it does so very rhythmically.
    From what I have gathered, looking at the galaxy like a plate, we transit from one side of it to the other on a regular basis and the pass through (of the center point,[sic] the galactic plane) takes a couple of decades to accomplish.
    We apparently started the transit sometime after the year 2000 and will be out of the *zone* by 2020 there-abouts with out *peak* experience being around 2012.
    This is the big event which the calenders talk about.
    We have certainly seen lots of climate change which is most probably directly influenced by this event (more probable than the GW theories at any rate).
    But.....
    Who really knows.
    I subscribe to the philosophy of prepare for the worst, but expect the best.
    That way I am covered regardless of the outcome (I hope:)).
    And if the crap hits the fan and we all die......(which I don't expect to occur) so be it.....worrying about it will not help, it will just make one miserable during what time one actually does have.

    I do advise watchfulness over the next few years though, as there is enough BS and general weirdness going on that it is quite foolish to be oblivious.
     
  13. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Staff Member

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    That's a really good quote - the world is always dying, and being reborn. Every day.
     
  14. citizenzen

    citizenzen Custom User Title

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    Because it is nonsense.

    And falling for the same nonsense time and time again is the hallmark of fools.
     
  15. citizenzen

    citizenzen Custom User Title

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    Everything old is new again...

    Harmonic Convergence

    Harmonic Convergence is a New Age astrological term applied to a planetary alignment which occurred on August 16 to 17 1987.

    The timing of the Harmonic Convergence allegedly correlated with the Maya calendar*, with some consideration also given to European and Asian astrological traditions. The chosen dates have the distinction of allegedly marking a planetary alignment with the Sun, Moon and six out of eight planets being "part of the grand trine".

    The event had been predicted by author Tony Shearer in his book Lord of the Dawn (1971). One of the principal organizers of the Harmonic Convergence event was José Argüelles. According to Argüelles' interpretation of Mayan cosmology, the selected date marked the end of twenty-two cycles of 52 years each, or 1,144 years in all. The twenty-two cycles were divided into thirteen "heaven" cycles, which began in AD 843 and ended in 1519, when the nine "hell" cycles began, ending 468 years later in 1987.



    *There's those magical and mysterious Mayans again.
     
  16. earl

    earl ?

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    I've been around long enough to recall this guy and his proposition.:D He was 1 of the early New Agers to jump on the so-called Mayan prophecies bandwagon, publishing some books on the subject. Did he do it for a bit of fame & $ or was he just a pollyana-who knows? Guess cheerful dubious thinking beats dubious morose thinking however.;) Of course, New Agers can develop their own unthinking dogma every bit as much as a traditional religion can. earl
     
  17. citizenzen

    citizenzen Custom User Title

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    You're focusing on the words cheerful, and morose.

    While I'm more concerned with the word dubious.
     
  18. shawn

    shawn New Member

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    They did make a really good calender though as it is extremely accurate, so one has to wonder how they acquired that ability.
    I have read numerous speculations ranging from the really zany to reasonably rational, but nobody really knows definitively how they developed their astronomy skills.
     
  19. citizenzen

    citizenzen Custom User Title

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    I can live with that.

    Sometimes we just don't.



    BTW, I wasn't denigrating their astronomical skills. I was just commenting on how that last time (in my memory) that someone tried to predict a magical date it was "based on" the Mayan calendar.
     
  20. Pathless

    Pathless Fiercely Interdependent

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    To be fair, the 2012 phenomenon is not just based on one book. John Major Jenkins wrote Maya Cosomogenesis 2012, and Terence McKenna, that lovable nut, was obsessed with 2012 as the end-point of human history, at which point all of humanity would come face to face with some kind of Transcendent Other and the world as we have known it would fall away in many illusory layers like the skin of an onion. The "wiring under the board", according to Terence, would then be observable and available for (whatever) humans (will become) to grok and interact with. His general hope was that everyone would become subjected to an ongoing psychedelic trip from 2012 on, as best I can understand and recall. Barbara Hand Clow has devoted a whole website to 2012, and many others have written about the 2012 date.

    I am not endorsing any of these views and find the 2012 hype rather ridiculous myself, although I must say that it has colored my vision and perspective at points in my life. I agree with the Theosophical Society's accounting of it to an extent. I do believe that the 2012 phenomenon is a Western appropriation and obsession with a certain detail of one of its conquered cultures, and being just that, is not unique. Where I have to disagree with the TS's account is in their subsequent return to a western-centric viewpoint. The second half of the piece returns to the idea that all events of any consequence to the world at large are to be found in the timeline of western culture, or alternatively, in the appropriated timelines and cultures of its conquered peoples. I couldn't disagree with this view more. For me, the timeline of western culture is one of the most barbaric ongoing events ever to afflict the planet. It's quite ironic that the TS starts out by not only discounting the ridiculous claims made by 2012 subscribers, but also (barely) touching on the Western appropriation of the date from the Mayans. But the Theosophical Society engages in this kind of appropriation when it observes history as some linear drama that is building towards some kind of redemption or revelation. Yet to me, its clear that any kind of meaningful redemption/revelation must create a situation where this silly notion of some great linear drama of history unfolding towards some culmination point of ecstatic spiritual transformation, "heaven on earth," yadda yadda frickin yadda, is replaced by the immediate realization that life on Earth is miraculous. Immediate realization of the fact that we are actual beings embedded in living systems must shock us out of our preoccupation with linear histories and allow us to inhabit the Earth and our local communities on the Earth in the now.
     

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