Your least favorite scripture passage

Discussion in 'Comparative Studies' started by Cino, Apr 25, 2021.

  1. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin Moderator

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    If your faith has scripture, what is the passage you like the least, that you struggle with the most? Why is that so?
     
  2. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    I’ve never been too keen on this bit:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lot's_daughters
    … while Lot and his family are in Sodom, two angels arrive and Lot shows them hospitality. However, the men (and boys) of the city gather around Lot's house and demand that he give them the two guests so they could ‘know’ them. In response, Lot offers the mob his two daughters instead, noting that they are virgins. The mob refuses Lot's offer, and the angels strike them with blindness, and then warn Lot to leave the city before it is destroyed.

    Genesis 19:1-9

    And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;

    And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.

    And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.

    But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

    And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

    And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,

    And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.

    Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

    And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

    Genesis 19 Read Full Passage
     
  3. stranger

    stranger wolfwing, a feral angel

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    It's the book of Hosea, it is very painful. The anguish hidden in the words is terrible, devastating. It is God's anguish for his Israel. I'm hesitant... It's heavy, we are lucky it only comes to us in a measure we are able to handle. He is kind to us, not allowing us to experience too much of the depth of grief contained within his great heart. I guess I must post this bit, I'm sorry...

    1. The Lord said to me, “Go, show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another man and is an adulteress. Love her as the Lord loves the Israelites, though they turn to other gods and love the sacred raisin cakes.”

    2. So I bought her for fifteen shekels of silver and about a homer and a lethek of barley.

    3. Then I told her, “You are to live with me many days; you must not be a prostitute or be intimate with any man, and I will behave the same way toward you.” -- Hosea 3:1-3
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
  4. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    The story of Lot is in the Qur'an. It is very similar to that account, except the details.
    Basically, Sodom was a lawless sort of place where Prophet Lot,
    [a nephew of Abraham, peace be with him] was trying to reform.
    Men were robbing and raping strangers, and Lot was eventually told to leave, but his wife wasn't saved.

    Conversely, Pharaoh was drowned with his army while pursuing 'Bani Israel', but his wife was saved.

    Genesis is an ancient scripture, and its accuracy is questionable. I love the Psalms of David :)
     
  5. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    I'm not always happy with questioning the accuracy of the Biblical passages that we don't like, while accepting those we do like. In a way I think the fact the 'difficult' bits are still allowed in there indicates the transmission is authentic, because a lot of people would have found it more convenient just to remove them?
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
  6. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    Up to you..
    Some people take the Bible, particularly Genesis, in an allegorical way .. including some Jewish sects.

    I, of course, don't have to worry so much about interpretation as I have the Qur'an to help me :)
    Naturally, there is a lot that I don't know, but overall, it confirms much of the OT as being true stories of
    "the men of old" .. and not just anecdotes or hearsay.

    What I don't understand, is why many Christians take the OT to be literal / accurate, while the NT says that Jesus
    was accusing the scribes of corruption. Naturally, a scripture that applies to before the flood of Noah would be
    hard to preserve, along with the various language issues over time.
     
  7. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Being an accurate translation and transmission doesn't mean what it says is literally true? It could still be a fable? Or fact mixed with fable? It preserves the way people thought and lived at the time it was written?
     
  8. ScholarlySeeker

    ScholarlySeeker Active Member

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    I have been trying to read the Psalms more in the Hebrew, and they are really beautiful. I remember it was one of the most incredible moments when I came to realize that Hallelujah was actually Hebrew! I know, I know, everyone knows that. Well, that includes me now too - LOL!
     
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  9. ScholarlySeeker

    ScholarlySeeker Active Member

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    This is actually very important. For instance, we have no real choice but to conclude Israel is literal. Now what kind or how much or where Israel is might be contested, but Israel itself, we usually take that literal. And yes there are things that are symbolic, and other things are described rhetorically, even poetically. It's difficult sometimes to figure out which is which.
     
  10. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    Excellent .. I'm glad to hear it :)
     
  11. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin Moderator

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    So is the a chapter or verse in the Qur'an which you struggle with, or find hard to understand? Or from the Hadith perhaps?
     
  12. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    Nothing from the Qur'an, I don't think.
    However, it depends how spiritually receptive one is when they are reading it.
    I never cease to learn some new concept.

    Hadith .. very likely. I don't completely trust them, and am wary of taking them as "absolute truth",
    even if deemed sahih ( sound ).
    However, I have no problem with the vast majority. They don't contradict the Qur'an.

    Some of them seem very rude towards Jews. I suppose it's because they deny Jesus.
    However, I don't believe everything I read. :)

    I personally believe that the righteous from amongst the whole of mankind will accept him when he returns.
    ..including Jews. What is there not to like, about a true messiah?
    A true messiah will not be a racist. He will be for all nations .. not just Muslim or Jew etc.
     
  13. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    And perhaps even more beautiful sung:
    Psalm 104 sung in ancient Hebrew



    This may seem to be rocking it up a bit too much for some, but it's possible to Google lots of other stuff.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
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  14. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    29 Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.
    30 Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.
    31 The glory of the Lord shall endure for ever: the Lord shall rejoice in his works.

    - Psalm 104 -

    Sorry @Cino .. I actually like those verses. I was just following up on @RJM Corbet's post.
     
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  15. RabbiO

    RabbiO הרב יונה בן זכריה

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    Of course it is important to note that the story says nothing about "boys" or any other small children. It is also important to note that Lot's behavior vis-a-vis his daughters is not considered exemplary by the text.
     

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