Belief, faith and evidence.

wil

wil

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I have been accused and just might be wimpy spiritually....definitely religiously wimpy.

I dont follow anyone's rules, dogma or tradition.

I follow whatever portions resonate of everyone's tradition but dance to no particular drummer or beat.

I light or blow out a candle based on needs or whim in the moment...this veggie dont need a rule book to tell me not to kill...or that eating animals or organs that clean and filter water may not be the best for ya.

There is discussion of metaphor and I believe some metaphor is metaphor me and others metaphor you and it all changes based on the time and your life and experiences.

There is what we know...and that may change as new info is presented...and what we believe...which by definition is something we dont know....something for some reason we have faith it is worth believing or we believe to be true.

This is why I will get involved in discussions of allegory and parables and metaphor and glean benefit from turning water into wine or virgin births but will not be attached to them.

Why knowingly base my spirituality on something which could be proven wrong? That is right I unknowingly base my spirituality on a lack of belief and faith.
 
Nick Cave defines religion as "spirituality with rigour".

He prefers the specific demands and traditions of religion over the vague, amorphous nature of modern "spirituality," finding that the church provides a lasting structure that embraces both his belief and his doubt.

He locates himself in the "Muddy Middle Ground", the space between belief and doubt.

For him (and I think Wil would agree) the church creates a space that can contain his skepticism while allowing him to participate in the energy and movement of faith. Of the churches, his preference is for the Anglican.
 
Longfellow said:
What is it about what you do or don't do, that someone is calling wimpy?
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I think Thomas may have hit on it.
Thomas said:
Nick Cave defines religion as "spirituality with rigour".
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I think that is it...or not it for me.
My spirituality doesn't lean toward religions but science. Science changes with new information and the old notions are discounted...religions get new information that discounts the old and foments apologetics...find a reason to maintain that which is unlovable or proven wrong.
Thomas said:
For him (and I think Wil would agree) the church creates a space that can contain his skepticism while allowing him to participate in the energy and movement of faith
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the portion of "church" I like is the camaraderie... and I like to discuss things with thinkers...me thinks this has pretty much became my church.
 
wil said:
There is discussion of metaphor and I believe some metaphor is metaphor me and others metaphor you and it all changes based on the time and your life and experiences.
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If the metaphors match experiences that people open to connectedness or oneness have, they are more true than they would be as mere facts. I guess I prefer phenomenological approaches. And pragmatism. If it is experienced and seems to work in ways that improve the quality of your existence, as though getting something helpful from another dimension
wil said:
This is why I will get involved in discussions of allegory and parables and metaphor and glean benefit from turning water into wine or virgin births but will not be attached to them.
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… then it is more “true” than facts. (Was supposed to be the end of the sentence in my previous comment!)
 
otherbrother said:
then it is more “true” than facts.
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To me...yes. that is i "use" the purported quotes, stories as parable or metaphor...that is can translate into something in my current life, issue, or understanding.

I use them often to minimize or make sense of perceived negative interactions.

Whether you call is like rain off your back or silver lining, or turn the other cheek, or you meant it for evil but G!d meant it for good...it dont matter to me.

I dont worry about next lives, my intent is to enjoy this one.
 
wil said:
To me...yes. that is i "use" the purported quotes, stories as parable or metaphor...that is can translate into something in my current life, issue, or understanding.

I use them often to minimize or make sense of perceived negative interactions.

Whether you call is like rain off your back or silver lining, or turn the other cheek, or you meant it for evil but G!d meant it for good...it dont matter to me.

I dont worry about next lives, my intent is to enjoy this one.
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Is there anything that you’re doing or would like to do for people all around the world, and/or for people in the future?
 
otherbrother said:
Are they afraid you’ll lose count of the angels on the head of a pin?!
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Yes..
Longfellow said:
Is there anything that you’re doing or would like to do for people all around the world, and/or for people in the future?
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Lol...more than I have done? Dude I am psssed my expirationdate...this is bonus time and you want me to work.
 
wil said:
I think Thomas may have hit on it.I think that is it...or not it for me.
My spirituality doesn't lean toward religions but science. Science changes with new information and the old notions are discounted...religions get new information that discounts the old and foments apologetics...find a reason to maintain that which is unlovable or proven wrong.
the portion of "church" I like is the camaraderie... and I like to discuss things with thinkers...me thinks this has pretty much became my church.
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When is about spirituality.

What are the main points from religion(s) that have improved your life as you can remember.

Same as well, what are the main points from science that have improved your life as you can remember?
 
Carlos said:
When is about spirituality.

What are the main points from religion(s) that have improved your life as you can remember.

Same as well, what are the main points from science that have improved your life as you can remember?
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Oh my that is a large task!

My wimpy knowledge of physics, evolution, biology, archeology, astronomy have allowed me to discount many scriptures as not historical or scientifically accurate which has allowed me to discount them as false in a literal sense and not get caught up in nonsense.

This lead me to read into various scripture as parables and allegorical to look for deeper meaning as what I read relates to issues in my life with relationships with fellow travelers, has made my responses less kneejerk than they would have been without.

The specifics have taken 7 decades to accumulate and would take longer to relate.
 
wil said:
Oh my that is a large task!

My wimpy knowledge of physics, evolution, biology, archeology, astronomy have allowed me to discount many scriptures as not historical or scientifically accurate which has allowed me to discount them as false in a literal sense and not get caught up in nonsense.

This lead me to read into various scripture as parables and allegorical to look for deeper meaning as what I read relates to issues in my life with relationships with fellow travelers, has made my responses less kneejerk than they would have been without.

The specifics have taken 7 decades to accumulate and would take longer to relate.
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I'm glad you reached that kind of understanding to discern better and follow the branches of knowledge that provide you a better understanding of the world with live in.

You are 20 years more advanced than I in a similar task I have been doing for about 50 years.

I didn't use the theories of science for the same purpose like yours, but solely observation, tests and evidence.

Surprisingly the science side corroborated the scriptures in my case. Amazing, we both make similar tasks and the results came different with tendencies of being opposite. This is calling me to review my work one more time.

My regards.
 
wil said:
Oh my that is a large task!

My wimpy knowledge of physics, evolution, biology, archeology, astronomy have allowed me to discount many scriptures as not historical or scientifically accurate which has allowed me to discount them as false in a literal sense and not get caught up in nonsense.

This lead me to read into various scripture as parables and allegorical to look for deeper meaning as what I read relates to issues in my life with relationships with fellow travelers, has made my responses less kneejerk than they would have been without.

The specifics have taken 7 decades to accumulate and would take longer to relate.
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Do you think that the gospels point to some real person who said that he had some good news? If so, what do you think his good news might have been?
 
Longfellow said:
Do you think that the gospels point to some real person who said that he had some good news? If so, what do you think his good news might have been?
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I think the authors thought that... I also think those that assembled the books felt it needed some help so they rearranged the ot to not represent the order of the Jewish Canon but to end the OT on a bad note...to accentuate their gospel
 
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