In your opinion.
No, creation is not proven history.
You seem to have crystallised your opinions and abandoned the search.
Meditations on life, the universe, and everything
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wil
UNeyeR1
Meditations on life, the universe, and everything....
I believe I should find a way to live my life and help others live theirs...
I believe I should find a way to live my life and help others live theirs...
Tony Bristow-Stagg
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My 2c.
The One Absolute, One infinite .......gives creation from the Holy Spirit, manifesting all the worlds of God, to guide all the "Human (Rational Mind) species, that inhabit all these worlds of God, in the radiating attributes of the infinite names, that reflect the Will and Purpose of the "One Absolute, One infinite ..." God.
Regards Tony
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Well, G-d or a G-d could exist that did NOT create everything.
Craz
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..or there is no creator god.
{Consider the Hindu concept of Brahman as the source of all existence. Brahman can be Theistic or not
As @Aupmanyav, who is an orthodox Hindu and an atheist, has explained.}
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
Ancient superstition. People cannot abandon it, ego or ignorance.
RJM
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Ok, many people have these sorts of thoughts and meditations. A person really doesn't have to be a great prophet and divine manifestation to start thinking about infinite universes and dimensions, and so on. But the question is where does it go to -- for the individual person? For the sick, the lonely and the broken hearted?
Jesus Christ made God available to individual human beings, as the Father who hears and responds to personal prayer. IMO
So where do these Baha'i thoughts go to that is more important and beyond Jesus Christ?
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
That depends on 'Samskaras' (Buddhists: Sankharas), how we are trained in our childhood. Family, society, education, experiences in life. Religion has hardly anything to do with it. Religions have many sugar-coated words. There are good Hindus and there are bad Hindus, most claim to be God-fearing.
"In Hindu Philosophy and some Indian religions, samskaras or sanskaras are mental impressions, recollections, or psychological imprints that colour one's thoughts and actions, .."
Samskara (Indian philosophy) - Wikipedia
So, the first question in arranged marriage is whether the groom or the bride belong to a 'Samskari' family? What is the background of the family?
Are they educated? What is the source of their income or possessions? Any one involved in criminal activities? Are they a peaceful family or garrulous? Is there peace among the members of their family? Etc. Other considerations come later.
Tony Bristow-Stagg
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RJM
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Ok but I don't see how that addresses what I said, or changes it. The Lord's Prayer is a personal petition to the heavenly Father, who hears and responds to individual yearning. Jesus came for the weak and lost and sick and broken. He was a healer. Elevated talk about infinite universes and world unity and so on has nothing really to do with that.
The point I'm making is I don't see where Bahaullah improves on Jesus Christ.
I know the response will be, oh the messengers are all equal, and each has a newer mission for a newer world and so on. But none of it convinces me that Jesus Christ needs updating or improvement by Bahaullah.
If you are in doubt there are numerous NT passages where Christ tells people how to pray directly to God the Father.
One day Jesus was praying in a certain place. When he finished, one of his disciples said to him, “Lord, teach us to pray, just as John taught his disciples.”
He said to them, When you pray, say:
Our Father,
who is in heaven
hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come.
Your will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us each day our daily bread.
Forgive us our sins,
for we also forgive everyone who sins against us.
And lead us not into temptation
But deliver us from evil
Then Jesus said to them, “Suppose you have a friend, and you go to him at midnight and say, ‘Friend, lend me three loaves of bread; a friend of mine on a journey has come to me, and I have no food to offer him.’ And suppose the one inside answers, ‘Don’t bother me. The door is already locked, and my children and I are in bed. I can’t get up and give you anything.’
I tell you, even though he will not get up and give you the bread because of friendship, yet because of your shameless audacity he will surely get up and give you as much as you need.
“So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.
“Which of you fathers, if your son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”
He said to them, When you pray, say:
Our Father,
who is in heaven
hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come.
Your will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us each day our daily bread.
Forgive us our sins,
for we also forgive everyone who sins against us.
And lead us not into temptation
But deliver us from evil
Then Jesus said to them, “Suppose you have a friend, and you go to him at midnight and say, ‘Friend, lend me three loaves of bread; a friend of mine on a journey has come to me, and I have no food to offer him.’ And suppose the one inside answers, ‘Don’t bother me. The door is already locked, and my children and I are in bed. I can’t get up and give you anything.’
I tell you, even though he will not get up and give you the bread because of friendship, yet because of your shameless audacity he will surely get up and give you as much as you need.
“So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.
“Which of you fathers, if your son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”
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RJM
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@Tony Bristow-Stagg
The main problem is although constantly throwing out cherry-picked NT quotes, most Baha'i have never actually read the New Testament -- or in your case not for decades, unless that's changed. Baha'i read mostly Baha'i writings and then think they have a 'gotcha' by using selected quotes from Baha'i sources but which ignore their New Testament context.
It's that I react to, and not to Baha'i belief.
However we've been through all this before and it doesn't go anywhere, imo
The main problem is although constantly throwing out cherry-picked NT quotes, most Baha'i have never actually read the New Testament -- or in your case not for decades, unless that's changed. Baha'i read mostly Baha'i writings and then think they have a 'gotcha' by using selected quotes from Baha'i sources but which ignore their New Testament context.
It's that I react to, and not to Baha'i belief.
However we've been through all this before and it doesn't go anywhere, imo
Tony Bristow-Stagg
Well-Known Member
What if the Father is not always a reference to the unknowable God, but to the Son returned in the "Glory of God", the Father? I have thought a lot about this over the years, mainly as I try to understand what Baha'u'llah has offered.
I do understand that these contemplations are outside your scope of faith.
Its a good exercise to see how many times the "Glory of God", or "Glory of the Lord" is mentioned in old and new testaments.
Regards Tony