Luciferianism

Discussion in 'Magick' started by Awaiting_the_fifth, May 14, 2005.

  1. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Did a quick search and I cant seem to find any threads here about any form of Devil Worship. How strange.

    As I understand it, there are different forms of satanism, some of which are downright Evil, and others which are not so.

    I have heard of the Luciferian religion which believes that Lucifer is not Evil at all, he is simply another God, like the Hebrew God. The two of them had a big barney at the beginning of time which the Hebrew God won and he banished Lucifer to Hell. Eventually he will escape from Hell, give God a good kicking and rule the Universe.

    I find this idea that the Devil is actually an OK guy fascinating.

    Is anyone else here familiar with this or any other form of positive Devil Worship?
     
  2. dailogue is the best

    dailogue is the best New member

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    hi,brother. I don't agree with you. To worship satan is not something fascinating for me. Satan is something that we should fight either inside us or outside us.some people worship satan because he is mercyless. those people has suffered and they think it is better to worship satan who will take revenge for them. but we all are exposed to make mistakes. where is mercy? we all do mistakes because ther is no body perfect. what then? what if you make mistakes? are you going to be desperate and dissappointed? no, with God, ther is always a new page fpr God forgives and gives others a new chance.God is all merciful, satan is not. we need mercy and love and not the contrary.
    with my best wishes
     
  3. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Firstly, I just want to clarify that I do not worship Satan, I may have given that impression, sorry.

    I cannot see why anyone would ever worship the Satan presented by Christianity. Dispite any benefits of revenge or temporary power, to do so would mean an eternal life of pain in the fires of Hell.

    There must be some alternate view of Satan among his followers.
     
  4. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    Just to mention that I'm going to move this thread to the Alternative section, where it may well be better served. :)

    Also, indeed, there are different forms of Satanism - for example, I'm given over to the impression that Anton LaVey effectively tried to remove a lot of the perceived unpleasantness regarding Satanic practice - ie, decapitating cats for sacrifice - and effectively made the Church of Satan into a form of social-political group focussed on the empowerment of the individual. In which case, Satan becomes a metaphoric emblem for the struggle of the self against wider social controls and proscriptions.

    Simply my perception anyway - though I'm sure it won't be long before we have one of the more respectful and polite members of Satanic practices stop by and provide a more useful answer, and perhaps even join in a few more discussions, to helpfully provide more insight from their own unique perspective.

    Just in case that causes some concern, it's worth referring to the Code of Conduct with regards to respecting the faith of the members on the particular faith board being posted on. So the limitations of discussion regarding Christian issues will differ according to whether they are posted on the Christian, Islam, or Alternative boards, for example. Hope that helps. :)
     
  5. mee

    mee Interfaith Forums

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    the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one (satan the devil)1 john 5;19so he even has power over the religions of the world and people dont even realize this
     
  6. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    So he has power of yours, then, mee? ;)

    Anyway, this thread is now in the Alternative section, so we should encourange expression of alternative theological views of Satan - for a discussion of specifically Christian perspectives of Satan, I recommend the following thread:

    http://www.comparative-religion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1196

    or perhaps the creation of a new thread, discussing Christian viewpoints of Satan on the Christianity board.

    Hope that helps. :)
     
  7. bgruagach

    bgruagach eclectic Wiccan

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    Part of the problem with defining Satanism is that it is common for religions to demonize the deities of religions they feel are competitors. For instance, it's not a coincidence that the Christian image of the Devil looks so much like a mixture of European Pagan deities such as Pan, various horned gods, etc. It's always a lot easier to convince people to buy what you're selling if the competitors are clearly depicted as undesirable.

    This resulted in some authentic Pagan religions being equated with Satanism or devil worship. If your world view says that every religion not your own is Satanic, then it becomes a pretty simple way to classify things. It doesn't mean it's correct though.

    If we look at the history of ancient Egypt, even deities such as Set changed over time. He started out as a god that was revered and respected by some people, but as different clans and cultural groups in Egypt came together and combined their mythologies and religious systems, Set's role changed from a god who was worshipped to a god who was deemed the antagonist in a conflict with another god, Osiris. The question we have to ask is whether the good Set is the correct one, or is the bad Set which came later? Or are both correct in some way? And which Set are modern worshippers following anyways?

    I'm not a Satanist or a devil worshipper but a Wiccan, and I'm very familiar with how all Pagan deities have been classified as Satanic by those who are determined to stamp them out. Some would say that because I'm Wiccan I am therefore Satanic -- but then I'd suspect they would also classify many Christian, Jewish, or Muslim religions as Satanic too because they weren't following the "correct" denomination (whatever that is supposed to be.)

    There are undoubtedly a few people in the world today who do embrace the very worst stereotypical Satanism as their own... but they seem to be few and far between, although I'm sure you can dig them up if you search on the Internet for them. It seems the majority of these types are merely into it for the shock value, or are like LaVey's Satanists who are using it all as a metaphor for rejecting oppressive institutions and empowering the individual.

    But then I'm not a Satanist so maybe I'm getting their philosophy all wrong. They can surely speak for themselves if we care to look for them and ask them.
     
  8. alexa

    alexa somewhere in time

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    If my memory doesn't fail me, we have only a member who officially declared on Introduction board to be a LaVeyian Satanist. I didn't see her posts since.
     
  9. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Found a couple of interesting sites. The first seems to be written by a well informed but unbiassed individual, the second I think is actually written by a Luciferian.

    I would not recomend any easily offended christians should read the second one.

    http://www.spiralnature.com/spirituality/satanism/luciferianism.html

    http://www.geocities.com/digital3v14/texts/modluc.html

    It seems that the author of the second site has adopted a non-deistic form of luciferianism which is essentially a license to be arrogant and selfish.
     
  10. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    Church of Satan

    I'm also going to post some information and links from a few other sites, to try and provide an introductory perspective of Satanism, especially from LaVey's Church of Satan:

    Religious Tolerance Org:
    http://www.religioustolerance.org/satanis1.htm

    Additionally:

    And from the Church of Satan website:
    http://www.churchofsatan.com

    there are a list of articles providing more information on CoS ideas:
    http://www.churchofsatan.com/home.html

    of which "The Nine Satanic Statements" is perhaps the most integral:
    http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/NineStatements.html


    See if that helps for starters...

     
  11. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Re: Church of Satan

    Seems to be the opposite of just about every other religion out there.
     
  12. Marcion

    Marcion New Member

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    I've hardly ever come across historical references to a Radical doctrine of Satanism, but there were a few actual movements a few centuries back.

    Most historical Satanists seemed to be Monarchian; they thought Satan was a good angel of God, as opposed to being evil. Michael/Christ was the jealous, evil angel of heaven who disturbed Satan's creation here on earth.

    The ones that were more Radical completely reversed to role of the medieval Cathar dualists into a system saying something like:

    Lucifer, the lord of Light, Creator of the Universe and Paradise for Mankind.

    Jehovah, the lord of a distant heaven; secretly invaded Paradise and led astray mankind with the poison of the tree of death (Though Lucifer preserved the soul of man).

    Christ came to lead astray Lucifer's world, but bringing mankind unto the stranger god, Jehovah...
     
  13. Mastorn

    Mastorn New Member

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    Ave,

    Greetings all. I am a 20 year old Luciferian/Devil Worshiper. I'll get into exactly what that means in a moment. I just thought I'd join the forum to answer your questions from one whom is actually walks on the Left Hand Path (once again, will be explained later). First a bit about me. I am from Iowa and am the only Luciferian that I know of in the area. I have studied the occult for about 7 years and been a Luciferian for about 4. I have studied all of the world's religions. Currently, I am attending college and going for a double major in philosophy and psychology. I have a very strong interest in both topics, as well as theology (I may end up getting a religion minor). My interest in Satanism is not due to any simple angst-fueled rebellion. It is due to a personal drawing to what most people consider to be the "dark side." I do not see the Devil as "evil". I do not see him as necissarily all "good" either. I'd say that I see him as pro-humanity, but is not afraid of tough love when necissary. I see the Christian god (should he exist at all) as just one of many gods. I do not believe he created the universe or the world or anything like that. I don't believe the Christian god to be all powerful or to be good. I don't believe the Christian god to be all evil either. I would say however that the Christian god appears to have a history of being not terribly fond of mankind. I don't believe that any god (including Satan) created the earth and I don't believe that any god that mankind worships is all powerful and all knowing.

    Now, getting a bit into what Luciferianism, Satanism and Devil Worship are.
    The first term I would like to introduce to you is Left Hand Path. This is the term that Satanists and Luciferians of all kinds use as a sort of blanket term for all religions that focus around the Devil in some way. If you want to see the common linkages between these religions I suggest two articles which I wrote for my website "The Kindred Association."
    http://kindredassociation.satanicwebsites.com/LHP.html
    http://kindredassociation.satanicwebsites.com/revolution.html

    Now within the Left hand path, the most popular religion currently is Satanism. The most popular form of Satanism currently is "Modern" Satanism which is also known as atheistic Satanism or LaVeyan Satanism (name after its founder, Anton LaVey). Modern Satanism does not believe in any literal deity. They either see Satan as simply a useful symbol to represent their beliefs about the world, or they see Satan as a "dark force" within nature. The quotes that you've had on this post so far are from Modern Satanist works. In particular "The Satanic Bible" which was written by Anton LaVey. Note that most Satanists do not share every belief in the Satanic Bible. In fact there are quite a few who do not use it at all. I personally see the Satanic Bible as a decent "beginners" text on Satanism, but its view is much too simplified and two-dimensional.
    There is also the form of Satanism which believes in a literal god or entity called Satan. These Satanists are known as "Traditional" Satanist. They are also known as theistic Satanists or sometimes Devil Worshipers. The views of Theistic Satanists very greatly on many issues, but they tend to be ok with this. Most Theistic Satanist see Satan as a multi-faceted deity whom answers to many names (such as Belial, Lucifer, Samael etc). Satan tends to be seen as a deity whom desires humanity to evolve on both an individual and worldwide scale. Satan is seen as encouraging individuals to question dogma of all kinds (not just chrisitan, and not just religious). Most Satanists do not believe Satan desires flocks of worshipers like other gods, but simply desires mankind to free itself. There is no one "holy book" for theistic Satanists although many find inspiration in the Diabolicon written by Michael Aquino, The Book of the Law written by Crowley, the "inspired" texts of the Yezidis and many works of literary Satanism.

    While I include myself amongst Satanists, I feel that I best described as a Luciferian. Luciferianism is a very loose religion right now due to there not being many individuals involved in organized groups. There arn't many central dogmas to Luciferianism, but there are general trends in belief. Many Luciferians do not believe Lucifer to be the same as the Prince of Darkness. They see Lucifer as more of an angel of light, lacking the cthonic aspects that Satan is often seen as having. Lucifer is also seen as desiring humankind to evolve. Luciferians tend to be more spiritual that Satanists, although we do not negect the carnal. My personal brand of Luciferianism is explained in the following essay:
    http://kindredassociation.satanicwebsites.com/luciferianism.html

    Well, there is Satanism 101 for you. If you have any questions, please feel free to ask. I may respond to some of the posts made previously on here next.

    Ave,
    Mastorn
     
  14. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    Hi Mastorn, and many thanks for that introduction - much appreciated. And welcome to CR. :)
     
  15. TLF

    TLF New Member

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    Luciferianism is not Satanism as such, though some of the ideals of Luciferianism is shared by Satanists. Modern Satanism has its roots in the Church of Satan founded in 1966. Before that there can hardly be said to have been any form of "standarized" Satanism - the older Satanism mainly consisted of individuals or small groups partaking in simple forms of desecrations of things considered holy in the Christian Church (mainly a rebellion against the Catholic Church of Rome).

    Luciferianism is different. First of all it's older and has its roots in French occultism, which again draws on older Gnostic sources. Luciferianism is a Gnostic Belief, i.e. (in this case) the Luciferian beleives he can become as his idol. But Lucifer is not identified with the "Fallen Angel" or the "Opponent of God", but rather as something completely different. In one aspect he's a personal god, much alike the Greek "Daimon", in another aspect he's the Creator of the perceiveable world (the Demiurge). There's not a "Heaven" or "Hell" as understood by the Christians, but rather several planes of existance - this physical one perceived as the gross and lowest (hence we are already "in Hell"). By raising the spirit we may access the higher, more subtle planes, and this is done through education and occult studies that gradually enable to aspirants to contact the spirit-world.

    In Luciferianism morality is something personal and not something to be dictated by "divine rules". Luciferianism is against all restrictive systems and beliefs, and it's almost comic to see so-called Luciferian-Satanists with preferences towards facism and extreme right-wing politics. Lucifer is considered as a "free spirit", a "friend of mankind" etc. and he doesn't mix too well with repression ... :)

    For an informative site, see: http://www.neoluciferianchurch.org
     
  16. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    Many thanks for that, TLF, and welcome to CR as well. :)

    Also, as a general pointer to this thread, I'll post a link to the Neo-Lucifarian Chruch FAQ, as it addresses various specific issues in more detail from that group's perspective:
    http://www.neoluciferianchurch.org/faq-en.htm
     
  17. Satanist

    Satanist New Member

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    In answer to the original poster.
    First I am a satanist and second I am totally ignorant of Luciferiansism becouse it is not the form of Satanism that I have learned or struggle to live according to.
    I want to help out answering what I can.
    Most forms of Satanism, even those who idealise evil,
    that are know see satan as a positive figure.
    Some forms of satanism does not use idealised "evil" but usually there is not so much difference.
    The Laveyan Satanism see "Evil" as both a relative way to be carfully aware of the society we live in and as an actual systematical content.
    There is a content of related facts and beheavors
    that exist independent but that fits the christian wiev of evil
    with the exeption that it is actually positive and creative for the Satanist
    instead of damning or punnishing him.
    The purpose of the label "evil" for the satanist is mostly separation
    and to teach himself fear Christianity and accept his own flaws.
     
  18. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Hi Satanist, thanks for the reply,

    So do you actually believe in the deity, Satan? And if so do you worship him and how?
     
  19. Satanist

    Satanist New Member

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    I didn't think that kind of short questions were used here or that was my initial impression of all those neat posts but here I go.

    There are different takes within Satanic religion for there are for good or ill there is different satanism that doesn't quite agree about everything.

    I count myself to the Laveyan Satanism according to which there is devine(magical or just philosophic) principes but no Gods( as people tend to imagine them) except as sympolic language but we do not disregard the potential wisdom in such symbols.
    Every individual Satanist is Satan becouse Satan is mankinds inborn animalistic and emotional nature but also our intelligent and wise nature.
    Satan is also identified with a number of forces in the universe
    and both the Satanist humanism and the Satanic cosmology
    defy Christian ethics thereby the name.
    It is a religion becouse it includes an idea of how universe works and is a belief that the nature of mankind is Satan.

    In short this is a philosophical and ethical form of Satanism
    that is open for any one that knows about and then agree on the idealogy.
    It does include many variants and much occult and many rituals of which I haven't done or learned anything about.
    I have read and then agreed, I m not a member of any of the groups and wouldn't know about the magic.

    If you are interested in actual worship, you should go the home peage of the Temple of Set which is more typical religion based on mostly the same ethic
    but in addition of belief in a God they worship and they claim is supporting them. They are very found of egyptian religion and seems to more disciplined and almost miliant.
    I don't know if they publish books that you can buy but they are found of secret books and initiating tutelage or whatever they called it.
     
  20. Awaiting_the_fifth

    Awaiting_the_fifth Where is my mind?

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    Thanks for the info satanist. Sorry if my question was a bit direct, no offense intended.
     

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