Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste all,
didn't they determine a few years ago that all humans can be traced back to 7 females through MDNA?
didn't they determine a few years ago that all humans can be traced back to 7 females through MDNA?
Differing Views of God
- Thread starter Siege
- Start date
bob x
Well-Known Member
"Steve? 
"
That's from a slogan among the gay-basher Christians in the US, "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve!"
"didn't they determine a few years ago that all humans can be traced back to 7 females through MDNA?"
That is only the mitochondrial DNA, that is passed from your mother's mother's mother's mother's.... mother. You still have autosomal DNA from your mother's father's father's mother's.... mother, who is not one of the 7. The Y-chromosomal DNA (father's father's...) likewise goes back to only a limited subset of the males who lived way back when.
"That's from a slogan among the gay-basher Christians in the US, "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve!"
"didn't they determine a few years ago that all humans can be traced back to 7 females through MDNA?"
That is only the mitochondrial DNA, that is passed from your mother's mother's mother's mother's.... mother. You still have autosomal DNA from your mother's father's father's mother's.... mother, who is not one of the 7. The Y-chromosomal DNA (father's father's...) likewise goes back to only a limited subset of the males who lived way back when.
bob x said:"Steve?
That's from a slogan among the gay-basher Christians in the US, "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve!"
"didn't they determine a few years ago that all humans can be traced back to 7 females through MDNA?"
That is only the mitochondrial DNA, that is passed from your mother's mother's mother's mother's.... mother. You still have autosomal DNA from your mother's father's father's mother's.... mother, who is not one of the 7. The Y-chromosomal DNA (father's father's...) likewise goes back to only a limited subset of the males who lived way back when.
Unfortunately, Christians are not the only people to corner the market, when it comes to bashing...Gay advocates are just as cruel.
kind of reminds me of a school yard brawl...no one wins, but everyone loses.
bob x
Well-Known Member
I've never heard of anyone beaten to death by "gay advocates"....Quahom1 said:
suanni
Confused
Back to the original question at hand. I've never heard of another perspective of God other than the usual Christian and pagan perspectives. However, I suppose me being different(!) I view the Maker of all slightly different. I'm not sure of what form The Maker takes. In my opinion mankind personified the Maker in order to identify with something he couldn't see but knew was there, hence the many different views of the Maker and the different takes on how to honour & love the Maker. And I believe that nobody is wrong in the way that they love The Maker.
arthra
Baha'i
Good to read your note Suanni!
My reply:
I liked your wording when you wrote:
"In my opinion mankind personified the Maker in order to identify with something he couldn't see but knew was there, hence the many different views of the Maker and the different takes on how to honour & love the Maker. And I believe that nobody is wrong in the way that they love The Maker."
In the Baha'i Faith we believe God is Unknowable and that men have at times developed concepts of "god" from their "imaginations" and "idle fancies".... that the Attributes of God though can be "visible" or appreciated through His Messengers.
Here are some excerpts from the Baha'i Writings on the subject:
"Some, deluded by their idle fancies, have conceived all created things as associates and partners of God, and imagined themselves to be the exponents of His unity. By Him Who is the one true God! Such men have been, and will continue to remain, the victims of blind imitation, and are to be numbered with them that have restricted and limited the conception of God."
And the following:
"To every discerning and illuminated heart it is evident that God, the unknowable Essence, the Divine Being, is immensely exalted beyond every human attribute, such as corporeal existence, ascent and descent, egress and regress. Far be it from His glory that human tongue should adequately recount His praise, or that human heart comprehend His fathomless mystery."
Finally, here the Messengers of God are called "Primal Mirrors" and "Tabernacles of Holiness":
"These Tabernacles of Holiness, these Primal Mirrors which reflect the light of unfading glory, are but expressions of Him Who is the Invisible of the Invisibles. By the revelation of these Gems of Divine virtue all the names and attributes of God, such as knowledge and power, sovereignty and dominion, mercy and wisdom, glory, bounty, and grace, are made manifest."
- Art
My reply:
I liked your wording when you wrote:
"In my opinion mankind personified the Maker in order to identify with something he couldn't see but knew was there, hence the many different views of the Maker and the different takes on how to honour & love the Maker. And I believe that nobody is wrong in the way that they love The Maker."
In the Baha'i Faith we believe God is Unknowable and that men have at times developed concepts of "god" from their "imaginations" and "idle fancies".... that the Attributes of God though can be "visible" or appreciated through His Messengers.
Here are some excerpts from the Baha'i Writings on the subject:
"Some, deluded by their idle fancies, have conceived all created things as associates and partners of God, and imagined themselves to be the exponents of His unity. By Him Who is the one true God! Such men have been, and will continue to remain, the victims of blind imitation, and are to be numbered with them that have restricted and limited the conception of God."
And the following:
"To every discerning and illuminated heart it is evident that God, the unknowable Essence, the Divine Being, is immensely exalted beyond every human attribute, such as corporeal existence, ascent and descent, egress and regress. Far be it from His glory that human tongue should adequately recount His praise, or that human heart comprehend His fathomless mystery."
Finally, here the Messengers of God are called "Primal Mirrors" and "Tabernacles of Holiness":
"These Tabernacles of Holiness, these Primal Mirrors which reflect the light of unfading glory, are but expressions of Him Who is the Invisible of the Invisibles. By the revelation of these Gems of Divine virtue all the names and attributes of God, such as knowledge and power, sovereignty and dominion, mercy and wisdom, glory, bounty, and grace, are made manifest."
- Art
Vajradhara
One of Many
Namaste suanni,suanni said:
thank you for the post.
please see the thread The Shared Myth under the comparative religions thread and you'll find therein a description of how the Hindu tradition sees God... which is quite a bit differently than you might be expecting.
suanni
Confused
Very interesting, Vajradhara and arthra.
I had to look up Baha'i, I had never heard of it before.
From what I am reading Vajradhara, the Hindu beliefs are very like the pagan beliefs, from the concept of God being everywhere and in everything, plus the many Gods for varying aspects of this world.
And from what I have gleaned, both religions stem from the same part of the world.
Pardon my ignorance, but did Baha'i 'splinter' from the Hindu religion?
I had to look up Baha'i, I had never heard of it before.
From what I am reading Vajradhara, the Hindu beliefs are very like the pagan beliefs, from the concept of God being everywhere and in everything, plus the many Gods for varying aspects of this world.
And from what I have gleaned, both religions stem from the same part of the world.
Pardon my ignorance, but did Baha'i 'splinter' from the Hindu religion?
arthra
Baha'i
suanni said:
My response:
The Baha'i Faith emerged from Shiah Islam much in the way we Baha'is believe that Christianity emerged from Judaism.... There was no historical connection to Hinduism as such even though today most Baha'is reside in India and many of these likely were from a Hindu background... The Baha'i Lotus Temple out side New Delhi has also become a major place of interest.
- Art
barefootgal9
Baha'i
This is a wonderful discussion! I love you all!
Can I marry all of you?!?
sigh.
Can I marry all of you?!?
sigh.
barefootgal9
Baha'i
Covenants, large and small
A couple of asides:
I think Baha'u'llah's teaching thatthere are two levels of the "Covenant" may be useful here. "The Most Great Covenant" is that between God and mankind, dating back to Noah ... put most simply (a paraphrase) "Follow Me and I will guide you always." It is symbolized by the Ark -- whoever took shelter within it (the laws of God) were in safety. And there is "The Lesser Covenant" -- that between His Manifestation (Prophet/Chosen One) and the Manifestation's followers. Within the Lesser Covenant are ordinances of various kinds -- some to correct excesses and misunderstandings of the past - for instance, that it is all right to sacrifice a goat instead of your first-born son -- some which seem only to serve to create a community of believers distinguishable from others ie Judaism requires circumcision as a symbol of Moses' covenant, Christianity does not. Muslims pray 5 (correct me if I'm in error) times daily, a Baha'i has a choice of 1 or 3 times.
My guess is that various dietary prohibitions, not mixing linen and wool, and other laws of this kind may fall into this group. While they don't have direct spiritual impact/Karmic burden/wrath of God implications, they do provide an opportunity for the believers to demonstrate easily and harmlessly (we hope) express their respect for the Prophet and their willing obedience to God, and this has spiritual benefit.
This is a beautifully diverse (and smart) group in this topic. I wonder if the concept of Divine Covenant is found in some form in everyone's Faith (or birth faith... for the "post grads" among us) ?
A couple of asides:
I think Baha'u'llah's teaching thatthere are two levels of the "Covenant" may be useful here. "The Most Great Covenant" is that between God and mankind, dating back to Noah ... put most simply (a paraphrase) "Follow Me and I will guide you always." It is symbolized by the Ark -- whoever took shelter within it (the laws of God) were in safety. And there is "The Lesser Covenant" -- that between His Manifestation (Prophet/Chosen One) and the Manifestation's followers. Within the Lesser Covenant are ordinances of various kinds -- some to correct excesses and misunderstandings of the past - for instance, that it is all right to sacrifice a goat instead of your first-born son -- some which seem only to serve to create a community of believers distinguishable from others ie Judaism requires circumcision as a symbol of Moses' covenant, Christianity does not. Muslims pray 5 (correct me if I'm in error) times daily, a Baha'i has a choice of 1 or 3 times.
My guess is that various dietary prohibitions, not mixing linen and wool, and other laws of this kind may fall into this group. While they don't have direct spiritual impact/Karmic burden/wrath of God implications, they do provide an opportunity for the believers to demonstrate easily and harmlessly (we hope) express their respect for the Prophet and their willing obedience to God, and this has spiritual benefit.
This is a beautifully diverse (and smart) group in this topic. I wonder if the concept of Divine Covenant is found in some form in everyone's Faith (or birth faith... for the "post grads" among us) ?