As a Christian what are your thoughts?

Discussion in 'Christianity' started by Manji2012, Oct 31, 2007.

  1. mee

    mee Interfaith Forums

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    with the advent of Christianity, God’s condemnation of homosexuality continued.—1 Corinthians 6:9, 10.





    While many people have changed their view and others are undecided, the Bible’s viewpoint is crystal clear: “You will not have intercourse with a man as you would with a woman. This is a hateful thing,” states the Bible. (Leviticus 18:22, The New Jerusalem Bible) No apologies, no concessions, no ambiguity—homosexuality is detestable in God’s sight. For ancient Israelites living under the Mosaic Law, the penalty was death. (Leviticus 20:13)


    we do not put people to death now , because we are not under the old way of doing things , but as we can see in corinthians it is still a no no , but now as Jesus taught ,it is love of neighbour, but for believers the praticing of wrong things would be out if we want to be inline with the christian way
     
  2. madeinrussia89

    madeinrussia89 Well-Known Member

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    Your heart is sin? Really? Well, what a newsflash that should be to the angels then.

    I think God created one type of sexual orientation to exist.

    Luke 23:56, “…And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.”

    There was no " oh, I don't think we're going to keep the sabbath anymore" or " yeah, you don't have to follow the commandments because of me ".


    You do also know that Nestorius was declared a heretic and thrown out? The Church doesn't error, even if some people might. And, the Patriarchs, though they are very holy, are not the heads of the Church, Jesus Christ is.

    Hate to break it to you, but we don't have a Pope that speaks for all of us like Rome. No Patriarch is the head of the Church. Whoever told you otherwise is wrong.

    Homosexual unions were never blessed by the Church, and it's ridiculous to think that they have some place in our antiquity. They never were, and it's bs to think it ever was.

    No, but I venerate him as an apostle of Jesus Christ.

    Minority subtype human? This is getting outlandish.

    I'm not presuming to tell you what is inside your head, I'm presuming that what you say is your nature really is not. People can be wrong without being crazy, and I think that is the case.

    It is sinning, it says clearly in the New Testament that it is sin, and it hasn't changed. Somehow I think Paul has more authority on writing on the state of man than you do.
     
  3. madeinrussia89

    madeinrussia89 Well-Known Member

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    Not "churches", the Church. God didn't set down hundreds of Churches, he set down one.

    Even if you are male or female, the outcome of homosexuality is sin. And if you don't accept that, it is simply denying the Word. It states it clearly as a sin in First Corinthians, and you can't get anymore straightforward than that.

    Asking simple questions about doctrine doesn't require a blessing.
     
  4. madeinrussia89

    madeinrussia89 Well-Known Member

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    And the point is to stop these things after we have been washed clean, not to keep on doing it. The bad deeds were not being sanctified.

    I see Paul talking about wrong lifestyles and deeds and turning away from them by the grace of God.

    Well, I do see this in absolutes. If something is a sin, it is entirely wrong, I see and have been taught no " ehhhh maybe it might be okay sometimes".

    If it was in the Bible, it needed to be said. To say so would mean the Bible had a lot of unnecessaries, and I believe that to be false. I cannot criticize the Word set forth to man or postulate about the importance of it. It is what it is.

    No, the entire world isn't going to come crashing down because someone either didn't read or misread a piece of scripture, but life is made better by Scripture.

    But it was said, that is the point.

    First of all, Paul was not have said that, because he has no authority on who will make it absolutely in to heaven and who will not make it at all. The letter of the Gospel is the Word, the Spirit and the Word are one in God, they don't have conflicting opinions.

    Spiritually, I believe and have been taught that Homosexuality is absolutely impure, there is no justification for it.

    One can turn away from sin, it isn't easy, but it can be done. If one cannot wipe away the attraction, they can at least pray to God to help them with that, and cease to do the action. But if you don't even try to stop the action, what can be said of that?

    I believe people can at least try to change, with all of their will.
     
  5. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    Hmmm....and which Church might that be I wonder. Now it appears to me, you aren't even referring to hundreds of churches, but hundreds of denominations, and referring to one church, but referring to one denomination. Most likely the one that was built by the behest of some Roman emperor who brought a number of leaders from various 'churches' together to form one mega church under one doctrine, and then set out to eliminate all the other thought?

    It did a pretty good job, it controlled thought for years, but documents and thought escaped and it is headed back the way it was the years after Jesus and prior to the 'church' deciding it was the only answer.

    As far as I can see if G!d was behind the first councils, G!d is also behind the division and expansion of the churches. Conversely if man is behind all of the denominations, it was also man that combined them in the first place.
     
  6. madeinrussia89

    madeinrussia89 Well-Known Member

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    Jesus with his Apostles set down one Church, one faith. And yes, the seven ecumenical councils are of great importance. It was a mission of the Early Church to dispell the heresy (but not to kill or force) that tried to challenge the Faith.


    You don't think the Church feels the blow of losing those documents? We lost so much thanks to either; other faiths, human stupidity, or war.

    And yet we should all seek to be one Church as in the beginning.
     
  7. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    It was other churches that burned books and destroyed everything they called heretical because it didn't fit within the confines of their views?

    But in the beginning there were various churches, it hundreds of years later that the consolidation happened and the extrication of opposing thought began.

    Of course the Christian Historicity depends largely on who is writing it, as no one/church/group appears to be able to look at an unbiased perspective.
     
  8. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    I see if I really want to take a break from this board I am going to have to be more drama-queeny about it. I really am tired of talking to brick walls, yet people keep addressing me.
    Not at all. My heart is a great blessing which God has chosen to give me. For me to call it "sin" would be a profound blasphemy against my Creator. For you to call it "sin" is just ignorance on your part.
    That is certainly ignorant. Are you really unaware that there are females who find males attractive, and also males who find females attractive? Those two are quite different. There are also, I can tell you from experience, males who find males attractive, and also, I have heard, females who find females attractive.
    Jesus specifically instructed his disciples to GATHER FOOD ON THE SABBATH. The very first commandment given about the Sabbath, even before Mt. Sinai, was DON'T GATHER FOOD ON THAT DAY.
    If your patriarchs and all your priests were wrong before, how do you know that they are not wrong now?
    You are mistaken. You may say, if you like, that the churchmen who blessed those marriages were wrong to do so (though again I would ask how you know that it is not the present-day churchmen who are wrong), but to deny that it happened at all is just perpetuating a lie.
    Are you saying it is outlandish for me to call myself human, or outlandish to note that the majority of humans are different from me? Both of those would seem to be quite simple facts.
    If you are not talking about what is in my head and heart, then WHOSE nature are you talking about??? I am telling you about the nature of *myself*, this person sitting here, thinking, feeling, attempting to communicate; you appear to be talking about some entirely different person who does not resemble me in any way, and does not exist except in your imagination.
    He would be an authority on the nature of PAUL, but I am the supreme authority on MY nature, just as you are the supreme authority on YOUR nature. If God is omniscient, He knows exactly as much about your consciousness as you do, but could not know more, because what you know IS, by definition, your consciousness. If someone claiming to speak for God told you that your consciousness was something different from what you are conscious of, then that person would be by definition wrong, and either lying or mistaken about speaking for God.
    But WHY should I do so? That would be despising the Creator for how He made me.
    The early church killed, and forced. It turned from persecuted to persecutor quite readily, because it had turned away from the morality of Jesus and adopted the morality of his crucifiers, as do you.
     
  9. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    Then, how come you cannot answer the question I posed to you?
    To repeat, I do not fell bad, and cannot pretend to feel bad, about having been the source of joy to others: WHY SHOULD I? And you think I ought to "make up for it" somehow: WHAT IN THE WORLD WOULD "MAKE UP" FOR HAVING GIVEN ANOTHER PERSON JOY?
    You told me that only a "blessed" priest could answer. If so, why don't you ask a priest and tell me what he says? Surely you can find one of your denomination easier than I can. I have no need for the secrecy of the confessional here: I am completely open about who and what I am, and have nothing to hide.
     
  10. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Any Priest worth his salt will tell you that the best we can hope to be is...human. It seems that all of us here (present company included) fall short of that goal from time to time...

    There are those who will never accept particular behaviors of others, and there are those who will never accept those that refuse to accept particular behaviors of others. Instead of agreeing to disagree, it becomes a vicious cycle of point counter point, with no answer in sight.

    This goes beyond socially accepted "norms" Bob. It is for a great many, an ingrained revulsion (no other kind way to put it), to certain behaviors people exhibit. No amount of arguing or attempted indoctrination, will change that.

    Just because laws are being passed in states to force acceptence/tolerance, what actually happens is isolation and segregation of people from people.

    "The management of this establishment reserves the right to refuse service to anyone, at anytime."

    That is not going to change anytime soon.
     
  11. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    I hate to be the one to tell you, but "The management of this establishment reserves the right to refuse service to anyone, at anytime" stopped being legal a long time ago. "That is not going to change anytime soon"? It changed decades ago. If you don't want to feed niggers, sinners, faggots, whatever, then don't open a restaurant; if you don't want to transport sinners, don't drive taxicabs; if you don't want to house sinners, don't be a landlord. Once you are open to the public, you don't get to pick and choose which part of the public you will deal with.
     
  12. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    No Bob, just because it is illegal, doesn't mean squat as far as people's thoughts and feelings. And it isn't illegal at all...look it up.
     
  13. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    In the America of my childhood, signs reading "The management of this establishment reserves the right to refuse service to anyone, at anytime" with the well-understood meaning "No Coloreds Allowed" were common, and were legally enforceable. Nowadays, you would not get in legal trouble just for posting such a sign, if that's all you mean, but you would indeed get in trouble if you actually thought you could get away with refusing service.
     
  14. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Same sign, sans the colored part. Still quite legal for an establishment to refuse service to anyone at anytime...
     
  15. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    If a black person walks in the door it is not at all legal for an establishment to refuse service. If you want the right to refuse service to "anyone", then you need to shut your door to the public, and only let in those you invite. If you want to establish some rules, for example refusing service to those with "No Shirt / No Shoes", that is different. But if you think it is legal to be open to the public, and yet refuse service for no reason to someone, you are mistaken, and would be well advised not to go into any business that serves the public.
     
  16. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    A business can refuse service Bob, at any time, to anyone...courts decide if it was legal in the long run...not YOU.
     
  17. bob x

    bob x Well-Known Member

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    I did not claim to be able to decide: else the laws of this country would be quite different, no? I am telling you that you are badly mistaken. Of course, you won't hear it from me. Well, that is not my problem. I am done with you.
     
  18. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    LOL, ok, take care, be safe, and God speed.
     
  19. Xavier Breath

    Xavier Breath Active Member

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    As a Christian, here are my thoughts:

    We are all brothers and sisters in Christ, sharing in the inheritance, and our sins have been washed away if only we will believe and confess that Jesus lived, died for us as an unqualified gift, and rose again.

    Shall we then fight amongst ourselves, and be consumed in our zeal to disinherit our brother, making a gruesome spectacle of ourselves in the sight of the lost and the vulnerable, and deprive them of the gift of salvation for which Christ suffered on the cross?

    Judge not, lest ye be judged. As ye judge, so shall ye be judged. As ye measure, so shall it be meted unto you.

    Cast not your pearls before swine, as they will trample them under foot, and turn and rend you...

    I know only Christ, and Him crucified.

    I am only fit to question the sincerity of my own faith.

    We are all sinners, and there is no sin "greater" than another.

    The saved fall back to sin daily.

    Salvation is assured, but we are to die daily to Him.

    There but for the Grace of God go I....
     

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