Zazen said:"after 20+ years studying occult topics"
was it worth it? did you ever learn anything concrete?
We should put that reply somewhere far more visible - good post, Ben.bgruagach said:I've learned that there is a huge amount that we really don't know about, particularly about how the mind works, our place in the universe, and whether we are the only intelligence (corporeal or not) in existence.
There is a lot that we humans are capable of that we often mistakenly attribute to outside forces. And there are a lot of things we tend to think of as being in our control that really isn't.
Love is a huge and very powerful force that really deserves a lot more conscious attention.
Creativity is a very primal way of touching the Divine. And the Divine really does dwell, at least in part, within each and every one of us.
Demons my butt.
And us 9 nine year kids who stopped using the Ouija board? We knew when the Gruber boys were moving it because all of a sudden the spirit couldn't spell worth a darn. Want to put a real stopper in the Ouija board nonsense? Just ask it a question neither one who uses the board can answer, but can be easily looked up like, "Spell the Russian word for foot."
All of a sudden your demon is a moron.
suanni said:The tarot. Aah, now there can be many takes on that one. Some people actually see the tarot as evil and there are many superstitions associated with the cards. Those who use the Tarot know that the cards guide and no more. The future is not set. No spirit is called upon for a reading and this may be the difference. In the use of the Ouija, spirits are called upon, and it is often assumed that the spirits know what is to come and that they never lie. That is not true.
He demonstrated how the body subconciously makes you move the glass on the board. They're little tiny movement that you don't really notice but it happens. It also happens with table tipping.
That's the point Snugglefluff is making - that at best the persons touching the glass are moving it subconsciously, hence why a glass may move - but not apparently due to external (ie, non-human) forces.
Derren Brown has turned interpreting how easily affected we are by subconscious cues into a form of TV entertainment.
LOL, what did you think I meant?? The "dark side"??
Lol, it appears that my board name is already mutating! Derren Brown is great because he disproves things that haven't really been proved before. Look on YouTube for his mediumship clip, it's quite uncomfortable especially seeing as he says he's not a psychic, he's just using cold reading and such.
Phew!!! Sorry, my bad!
For a moment there I'd thought we'd lost another one to "the dark side".
I'll try to read a little more carefully in the future.
I'd never heard of Derren Brown... being an ignorant American and all.
I thought you said he could move glass subconsciously... Telekenetically (is that spelled right?).
"The dark side" is the side of people who want to believe in magic, instead of rationality and reason (if those are two separate things).
So I checked out a couple of Derren Brown youtubes and loved them. My only question—because a scientist has to count the misses as well as the hits—is whether he played the BMX bike trick on a hundred people and just showed the one who played into his hand?
Other than that lingering question, it very entertaining and revealing as to how the human mind can react under certain circumstances. Thanks for sharing.