What makes a prophet?

Discussion in 'Abrahamic Religions' started by Cino, Sep 13, 2021.

  1. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    What makes a prophet in your faith?

    What is a prophecy? Is it about a future event? About another world or level of reality? About this world?

    When reading interpretations, commentaries, and exegesis of prophecies, does one still get enough of the inspired message?

    When reading a prophecy without any commentaries, does one still get enough of the inspired message?
     
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  2. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    When through an exchange...as you make the exchange you end up with more than you provided.

    That growth indicates your prophet...oh wait, that is profit....but hmmmm....ia there really a difference?
     
  3. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    What does it profit the prophet, good question. Jonah wasn't to keen, for example...
     
  4. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    There in lies the crux of the his suit eh? We're any of them? Jonah, Noah, Moses, Jesus...they all had to be convinced...

    Where as today they seem quite the opposite.
     
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  5. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Search, be your own guru.

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    There are no prophets in Hinduism.
    At the most an educated guess, if not hoax. Sure, there are various levels of reality. Real, perceptual and imagined.
    Hindus do not have to struggle with prophecies. There is one about the tenth avatara of Lord Vishnu, but that comes 425,000 years from now. Nothing that concerns the present. It will come when it will (and do what it will). Nothing that we have to prepare for at the moment.
     
  6. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Search, be your own guru.

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    Yeah, that is why evangelism.
     
  7. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Still thinking about this one. Why the need for a prophet? What is the function of a prophet? Is it to clarify to human beings the purpose of the Divine? A real prophet, obviously, not the usual shower of charlatans ...
     
  8. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    What about the Rishis, the Vedic sages, who authored the old hymns? I always considered them somewhat similar to the prophets of Monotheism, uttering inspired sayings and teachings that were preserved, passed on, and commented on. If I'm wrong in this understanding, I'm happy to learn!

    Similarly, the Buddha or Mahavira, while not prophets in the Biblical sense, are presented to have been in touch with fundamental truths and able to express them, and their teachings and discourses were preserved and passed on...
     
  9. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    I always wondered about the prophets in the bible...there are a plethora, were a plethora for a.short period of time.

    Have we missed a bunch along the way....or were they overated?
     
  10. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    A prophet accurately predicts future events? So a prophet, needs to get it right. Events need to happen as foretold. But there's more to prophecy than simply predicting what is to come. A prophet warns of dire future events, unless the listeners change their pattern to make right with their deity?

    A prophet's mission is to make people change their ways. Does Greta Thurnberg therefore qualify? Where does deity come into it?
     
  11. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Search, be your own guru.

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    Anything can inspire one, it could be something said by Bertrand Russell or Einstein. They were not prophets of any God. Rishis also were wise people. None claimed that he/she had been dispatched by Allah (there were females also among the wise, Rishikas; Maitreyi, Gargi and Lopamudra for example).

    Even I am spouting fundamental truths. I do not care if people do not understand or accept them. Mahavira and even Buddha talked about heavens, hells and devas. In my (not so humble) opinion, they were wrong there. But I can see that what they said was 2,600 years ago. We know better now, and do not need to resort to such explanations.

    "Female Rishis (Rishikas) of about 30 of them are named in the Rig Veda. Lopamudra was the wife of Agasthya. The meaning of the word 'Lopamudhra' is one, who is totally absorbed in herself, i.e., she is one of the Brahmavadhini Rishi-patnis.

    The Rig Veda mentions Romasa, Lopamudra, Apala, Kadru, Visvavara, Ghosha, Juhu, Vagambhrini, Paulomi, Yami, Indrani, Savitri, and Devajami.
    The Sama Veda adds Nodha, Akrishtabhasha, Sikatanivavari and Gaupayana.
    When it comes to talking about significant female figures of the Vedic period Ghosha, Lopamudra, Sulabha Maitreyi, Gargi Kakshivati, Dakshina Prajapathya, Vishvavara, Atreyi, Godha, Apala, Yami Vivasvathi, Lopamudra, Romasha Svanya, Aditi Dakshayeni, Ratri Bharadwaja, Vasukra Pathni, Surya Savitri, Indrani, Sarma Devasuni, Urvashi, Shashwati, Angirasi, Sri Laksha."
    https://epgp.inflibnet.ac.in/epgpda...000829IC/P001497/M015107/ET/14600120574ET.pdf
    https://www.google.com/search?q=Ris...hUKEwjMwvn83ZLzAhUoHbkGHQ1ACz4Q4dUDCAY&uact=5

    This page mentions the verse/hymn of RigVeda and its female author (Rishika).
    http://www.hindupedia.com/en/Women_as_Rishikas_in_the_Vedas
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2021 at 6:19 PM
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  12. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    Amos was more of a moral teacher than a predictor of future events?

    (edited to add): His predictions were not unlike Greta's, "if-then" scenarios.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2021 at 3:52 PM
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  13. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Thanks. I need to read Amos again. Is "if-then" not a future prediction? Jonah was upset because the people repented and got a reprieve. Muslims regard Job and Lot and Noah as Abrahamic prophets too, I believe?
     
  14. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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  15. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Oh yes. There is definitely that thing, like they used to yell at Mick Jagger: "Git yer 'air cut" and from Jagger: "I don't wanna be like you" lol

    But is a guru the same creature as a prophet?
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2021 at 7:24 PM
  16. RabbiO

    RabbiO הרב יונה בן זכריה

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    Neither Lot nor Noah are recognized as prophets by Judaism. Job is numbered among the seven non-Jews who are recognized as genuine prophets. Neither Jesus nor Mohammed, no surprise here, are recognized by Judaism as prophets.
     
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  17. RJM Corbet

    RJM Corbet God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    @RabbiO

    What's the criteria to qualify as prophet?
     
  18. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    Definitely a definition that differs from.secular to religious and also between religions.

    And that definition would determine who is and who isn't.
     
  19. RabbiO

    RabbiO הרב יונה בן זכריה

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    In the Talmud, in Tractate Nedarim we find -
    Rabbi Johanan said: The Holy One, blessed be He, causes His Divine Presence to rest only upon him who is strong, wealthy, wise and humble; and all these are deduced from Moses.

    How to interpret this? Well, in Tractate Avot we find -
    Ben Zoma says: "Who is wise? The one who learns from every person.
    Who is brave? The one who subdues his negative inclination.
    Who is rich? The one who is appreciates what he has.
    Who is honored? The one who gives honor to others."

    Rabbi Levitas of Yavneh says: "Be of an exceedingly humble spirit."

    Now, if you know anything about Judaism, anything about Talmud, you will understand that this is not the end of the discussion as to the qualifications to be a prophet. There are commentaries on the text and commentaries on the commentaries and commentaries on the commentaries on the commentaries on the text. So I'll let this suffice.
     
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  20. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    Rabbio Christianity breaks down major and minor prophets...does Judaism agree with this account?

    Have there been any prophets since your bible was canonized?

    (And I love that the discussions never end)
     

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