Is it wrong?

Alex P said:
Is it wrong to find women attractive? :/ Please give examples via bible scripture thanks.
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Hell no it' not wrong ! That is why we have stereoscopic vision, and stereo hearing.

It's what is in the mind, that makes it right or wrong.
 
Jesus never said that looking at a good looking woman was wrong, just wanting to possess her is wrong (that is wanting to have sex with her especially if she is married).
 
Quahom1 said:
Hell no it' not wrong ! That is why we have stereoscopic vision, and stereo hearing.

It's what is in the mind, that makes it right or wrong.
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LOL- actually, we have stereoscopic vision for the same reason all primates do- we need it for effective locomotion in the kind of environment we evolved in. It's handy for predation too.

That said, I don't think it's wrong to find women (or men, in my case :)) attractive. People naturally find others to be attractive.

What is wrong according to Jesus' teachings is then allowing oneself to imagine having sex with that person- that is, committing adultery in one's heart. Jesus recognized what modern psychology also recognizes- imagination is one step away from reality. The more we imagine something as possible, the closer we are to acting on it. Jesus recognized humans' natural urges but also our capacity for self-control. Of course, that is easier said than done. Recognizing beauty or attractiveness is not the same thing as allowing yourself to think about having sex with the person, although it takes discipline in one's thought patterns to avoid leaping to that conclusion.
 
Thanks for the replies!

I just find my eyes wander and tend to look towards women and certain areas... And It is real hard not to, it's like an auto pilot happens without thinking... :( I straight away look away but it happens...
 
Grace fills in between our intent and work to make ourselves better and the standard of God's perfection.

If you are recognizing it as you are doing it, and correcting it in yourself, grace allows forgiveness for your mistakes. As you correct yourself more often, it will become easier. Tis so with any habit. What we practice eventually becomes second nature.
 
Some of the forefathers in the OT had quite an issue with the ladies. Solomon and David for example.. Heck the Song of Solomon is pretty visual in some places where he was admiring those certain places on his pretty shulamite bride. :)
 
Faithfulservant said:
Some of the forefathers in the OT had quite an issue with the ladies. Solomon and David for example.. Heck the Song of Solomon is pretty visual in some places where he was admiring those certain places on his pretty shulamite bride. :)
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Ah, the difference between smitten beauty, healthy attraction, and porn... no woman looks away in disgust at the Songs...
 
Faithfulservant said:
porn yuck :( I wasnt even thinking of that...
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No, but you love a heck of a love story...:D

And men are visually oriented (even in their mind's eye). Songs is a satisfier for both parties...

Let me make it simple:

"He loves me"

"She is so beautiful"

end of songs.
 
I heard somewhere that the venacular of Genesis 2:23 was an exclamation from Adam along the lines of "this, This, THIS IS BONE OF MY BONES, FLESH OF MY FLESH!!!!" In other words: YOWZA! YOWZA! YOWZA!

I don't know if that's true or not. But I can imagine that Adam would have some kind of reaction like that. Imagine a blind date only to find out she's Heidi Klum. YOWZA!

The Bible contains several amorous passages that suggest it's alright to behold the beauty of a woman:

"Let thy fountain be blessed: and rejoice with the wife of thy youth. Let her be as the loving hind and pleasant roe; let her breasts satisfy thee at all times; and be thou ravished always with her love." - Proverbs 5:18-19

"Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead. Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them. Thy lips are like a thread of scarlet, and thy speech is comely: thy temples are like a piece of a pomegranate within thy locks. Thy neck is like the tower of David builded for an armoury, whereon there hang a thousand bucklers, all shields of mighty men. Thy two breasts are like two young roes that are twins, which feed among the lilies." - Song of Solomon 4:1-5

On the other hand, there are passages that warn against inappropiate lusts:

"My son, attend unto my wisdom, and bow thine ear to my understanding: That thou mayest regard discretion, and that thy lips may keep knowledge. For the lips of a strange woman drop as an honeycomb, and her mouth is smoother than oil: But her end is bitter as wormwood, sharp as a two-edged sword. Her feet go down to death; her steps take hold on hell." - Proverbs 5:1-5

"Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." - Matthew 5:27-28

I think there is a fine balance. Yes, look upon the beauty of a woman and appreciate how wonderful God has made her. That attraction is God given, intended to bring two people together. But I think also that we need to be careful that we don't turn that attraction to lust too soon, else we can short circuit the relationship. Infatuation is but for a moment, but love lasts longer (following I Cor 13).

"Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting; but a woman who fears the LORD is to be praised." - Proverbs 31:30

I think God is most concerned with our fidelity toward our mate or potential mate. Our eyes need to stay on the one that God has given us.
 
Is it wrong?

Trying, failing and trying again is bearing the weight of glory. Imagine you are carrying the ark of the covenant. It is heavy, and now imagine that the person who was helping you carry your end drops out on you, doubling the weight! That weight is the struggle we face so that glory is revealed in our midst. It is all of our animal urges, weaknesses, and mental treachery which constantly pulls us down, and God knows how much weight each bearer carries. Sometimes the one who should be helping us to shoulder the burden (fellow believers) drops out, and that means we are left carrying extra and stumbling more frequently. Those are the times when we carry double the weight and times when we fail, but that is not to our shame but the work of God.

Psalm 106
  1. Praise ye Jehovah. Oh give thanks unto Jehovah; for he is good; For his lovingkindness endureth forever.
  2. who can utter the mighty acts of Jehovah, Or show forth all his praise?
  3. Blessed are they that keep justice, And he that doeth righteousness at all times.
  4. Remember me, O Jehovah, with the favor that thou bearest unto thy people; Oh visit me with thy salvation,
  5. That I may see the prosperity of thy chosen, That I may rejoice in the gladness of thy nation, That I may glory with thine inheritance.
  6. We have sinned with our fathers, We have committed iniquity, we have done wickedly.
 
Faithfulservant said:
porn yuck :( I wasnt even thinking of that...
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Are you really that repelled by it?

I wasn't really speaking of porn.. But that in it's own is a difficult challange for many.

Dondi said:
I think there is a fine balance. Yes, look upon the beauty of a woman and appreciate how wonderful God has made her. That attraction is God given, intended to bring two people together. But I think also that we need to be careful that we don't turn that attraction to lust too soon, else we can short circuit the relationship. Infatuation is but for a moment, but love lasts longer (following I Cor 13).
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Thanks! Some good posts of scripture there! I really appreicate your time/post... I see there are two sides to the scale here and need to balance them?

Dream said:
Is it wrong?

Trying, failing and trying again is bearing the weight of glory. Imagine you are carrying the ark of the covenant. It is heavy, and now imagine that the person who was helping you carry your end drops out on you, doubling the weight! That weight is the struggle we face so that glory is revealed in our midst. It is all of our animal urges, weaknesses, and mental treachery which constantly pulls us down, and God knows how much weight each bearer carries. Sometimes the one who should be helping us to shoulder the burden (fellow believers) drops out, and that means we are left carrying extra and stumbling more frequently. Those are the times when we carry double the weight and times when we fail, but that is not to our shame but the work of God.


Psalm 106
  1. Praise ye Jehovah. Oh give thanks unto Jehovah; for he is good; For his lovingkindness endureth forever.
  2. who can utter the mighty acts of Jehovah, Or show forth all his praise?
  3. Blessed are they that keep justice, And he that doeth righteousness at all times.
  4. Remember me, O Jehovah, with the favor that thou bearest unto thy people; Oh visit me with thy salvation,
  5. That I may see the prosperity of thy chosen, That I may rejoice in the gladness of thy nation, That I may glory with thine inheritance.
  6. We have sinned with our fathers, We have committed iniquity, we have done wickedly.
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Nice thoughts and scriputre there too... Ain't easy being good huh?
 
Originally Posted by Faithfulservant
porn yuck :( I wasnt even thinking of that...
Are you really that repelled by it?

I wasn't really speaking of porn.. But that in it's own is a difficult challange for many
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Yes. I was with someone for 10 years and he was obsessed with it...and not just your run of the mill stuff... it got to where the bizarre was his obsession. I think its a sickness for some I know it is for him... I feel victimized seriously for some of what I went through in that 10 years.. Sometimes I think I should go get some therapy lol. I think the worst of it is that I couldnt help but think he was comparing me to those girls and I was found wanting.. which did a huge head trip on me. I think porn is a soul sucker to be honest with you.
 
Faithfulservant said:
Yes. I was with someone for 10 years and he was obsessed with it...and not just your run of the mill stuff... it got to where the bizarre was his obsession. I think its a sickness for some I know it is for him... I feel victimized seriously for some of what I went through in that 10 years.. Sometimes I think I should go get some therapy lol. I think the worst of it is that I couldnt help but think he was comparing me to those girls and I was found wanting.. which did a huge head trip on me. I think porn is a soul sucker to be honest with you.
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Actually that is pretty accurate on all accounts.

Porn is 'fools bane', fantasy that no human can possibly live up to. The problem starts with the one sided 'relationship' with a fantasy, and of course there is no imperfection from the other side, because both sides of the 'relationship' is controlled by just one person, in their mind. Then comes reality. The other person in the real part of the relationship is as human as the fantasizer, but with an unfair disadvantage. He/she can't compete with a fantasy.

The other thing is the chemical rush that people caught up in porn get. Yep that is right! Drugs produced by the porn addict's own body, keep them locked in the viscious cycle. endorphines and dopamine...and it isn't the ending they look for but rather the continuation of the anticipation (thus more endorphines and dopamine flood the brain).

How about that, Porn can be a drug addiction...

Crim Psych sends...
 
Alex said:
Nice thoughts and scripture there too... Ain't easy being good huh?
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If anyone should be able to be 'Good' it is me, but I'm not. The only thing I can do is be aware that I am a creature, stay busy doing good things, keep improving myself, focus on the positive, own up to my mistakes, etc. You know, just do the things that make sense to do. Its generally a bad idea for me to stand all by myself next to a big pile of money that isn't mine, holding a big canvas bag all the while wearing an invisibility cloak. I might start to think about stealing some of it. Actually, the idea does have some appeal.
 
path_of_one said:
What is wrong according to Jesus' teachings is then allowing oneself to imagine having sex with that person- that is, committing adultery in one's heart. Jesus recognized what modern psychology also recognizes- imagination is one step away from reality. The more we imagine something as possible, the closer we are to acting on it.
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I'm not sure that's the issue.

I think it might be that when we are unable to recognize the person as a soul and equate them them with their body, then we are losing touch with the Sacred. In other words, lust is an insult to the person and also to G-d's presence in our midst.

It is totally possible to enjoy a person's physical beauty as a manifestation of Divine Perfection.
 
Faithfulservant said:
I think porn is a soul sucker to be honest with you.
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I think this varies with perception. ie degrees. some will read those racy scriptures and blush, not wanting to discuss what is written. Others have issues with romance novels, comparing their hubbies to the heroes looking for the gallant knight in shining armor to sweep them off their feet. Others label various degrees as you said with porn.

Talk about looking at sex/the body in inappropriate ways. (note US mentality here) there are a number of R rated movies that I would let a 8 year old see, and PG-13 movies that I would prefer my 15 year old not see, mostly because they glorify the behaviours we are discusssing.

Weird person that I am, would take them to a nude beach but not to a frat movie...
 
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