Have you experienced a state of nonduality/infinity/oneness?

Vasu Devan

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No, no, no.
There has to be a balance.

Some people will not learn anything when they are warned, they just go and repeat their robbery and assaults.
Almighty God is the Fairest of All judges .. nobody gets punished more than they deserve.
..and don't forget the victims .. they sometimes suffer severely .. murder, rape etc.

Warnings are nothing more than threats. But loving an offender by teaching him how to love himself and others and, at the same time, teaching him how to earn a living by legal means is the best way to wean someone off the path of evil.

 

Aupmanyav

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.. but I just thought Jesus did in his gospels. He died to save us etc.

However, I do believe that if a divine being exists, it would need to be unconditionally loving or not be truly divine. I, personally, feel that view, while perhaps somewhat arrogant, was validated in my Oneness experience. Essentially that an Infinite Consciousness would not shut out anyone. That, all would be one, etc...
Well, Jesus cursed three cities and said that there fate will be worse than Gomorrah and Sidon. If accept Jesus, then one's fate is sealed. I do not know what Jesus died for.
Existence of divine is your view. I find no evidence for it. My Brahman is not a God.
 

Aupmanyav

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That won't work in India with 554,034 prisoners, many of them repeat offenders. Some can easily kill jailors. Even the police is afraid of them. They are treated like VIPs.
 

Vasu Devan

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I do not know what Jesus died for.
Then my guess is you haven't read the Bible. Or at least the New Testament. Or just maybe not John.
In any case, the Bible was created by the official Christian Church. Not Jesus.
Also, I have had more success seeking God within myself, rather than in trying to interpret secondary texts from unclear sources. I base my concept of god largely on what I perceived from knowing infinity as an experience rather than a concept.
 

Aupmanyav

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Why should I believe in what is written in Bile, new Testament or by John?
And as you said Bible has been repeatedly edited.
What did you find with your inner search?
I found none, so I do without God or soul. I do not need any.
 

Vasu Devan

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Why should I believe in what is written in Bile, new Testament or by John?
And as you said Bible has been repeatedly edited.
What did you find with your inner search?
I found none, so I do without God or soul. I do not need any.
There is no reason for anyone to believe those things if they don't want to. I wonder if your mispelling of Bible was accidental. 😅 I found that being infinite also meant being unconditional love. There was no superior being. All beings were one. I realize it could have just been a brain state but whatever one would define it as, I found the experience amazing and unique.
So I am God. So are you and everyone else. Quantum science proved that everything is energy and matter is just an illusion. Basically what our ancient gurus have been saying re maya is now proven by science. Doesn't mean much to most because the physical world is still only known to us through our physical senses. I'll know more if my consciousness still exists after my physical death and I no longer have my 5 senses.

I also believe that connecting with our subconscious can be a path to God but I realize that is not the God most monotheists are seeking. I find great peace in meditation and communing with my inner self. That is enough for me to find contentment with my life. My life may have some limitations but, in retrospect, I know it is one that many would also love.
 
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Thomas

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Regarding your initial questions:

consciousness has everlasting life without form after death
I'm not sure how such a consciousness might relate to what we experience as consciousness. There's a huge amount of evidence suggesting consciousness is a product of activity in the brain, and depends upon the physical organism for its process. It's rather a leap to suggest our biological consciousness necessarily equates to a non-biological state of awareness.

god is infinite unconditional love
I'd agree with that.

the more we practice love, the closer we get to god but god denies no one
I'd agree with that.

less strongly:
god is the mind of this infinite uncertain universe

I would disagree. God is more than mind, this seems to me like an argument that God is the exemplar of what we perceive/conceive. It's a useful way of talking about the Divine, but we should tread carefully, as the Divine transcends all categories, and mind is a category?

communing with our inner god is possible and everyone has an inner god
Well we labour under different definitions. If God is Infinite, there can only be one Infinite, etc. How can something lesser contain something greater? and God is not a matter of degree, you can't have a greater or a lesser, an inner and an outer.

That God is immanent is something else.

Just some thoughts ...
 

Vasu Devan

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Regarding your initial questions:

consciousness has everlasting life without form after death
I'm not sure how such a consciousness might relate to what we experience as consciousness. There's a huge amount of evidence suggesting consciousness is a product of activity in the brain, and depends upon the physical organism for its process. It's rather a leap to suggest our biological consciousness necessarily equates to a non-biological state of awareness.
Well, all that the biological aspects of our brain can do it understand reality through the senses. Which is ultimately an illusion according to quantum science and ancient religions both. When the senses die, there is no need for consciousness to die. It is possible to be aware of awareness.
Anyway, there is no point discussing this, since if we will find out, it will only be at death. Some few whose brains have been recorded as dead, come back with a rich description of a complex conscious reality but we will only know for certain ourselves when we die.
less strongly:
god is the mind of this infinite uncertain universe

I would disagree. God is more than mind, this seems to me like an argument that God is the exemplar of what we perceive/conceive. It's a useful way of talking about the Divine, but we should tread carefully, as the Divine transcends all categories, and mind is a category?

communing with our inner god is possible and everyone has an inner god
Well we labour under different definitions. If God is Infinite, there can only be one Infinite, etc. How can something lesser contain something greater? and God is not a matter of degree, you can't have a greater or a lesser, an inner and an outer.
I never meant 'inner god' as something lesser. Merely that the path to communion did not lie with external things but rather the mind which is not regarded as outer by many.
 

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Well, all that the biological aspects of our brain can do it understand reality through the senses.
There's a long philosophical tradition that there is nothing in the mind that was no first in the senses.

All experience is mediated through the senses.

Which is ultimately an illusion according to quantum science and ancient religions both.
Certainly quantum science reveals the substrate, but that does not render the manifestation as illusory per se – hit your thumb with a hammer and it hurts. In a religious sense, it's not that the world is illusory, rather that it, like the self, is not self-subsisting.

When the senses die, there is no need for consciousness to die. It is possible to be aware of awareness.
Well, when the organ of consciousness dies, then there is no longer a seat of consciousness. What cannot be shown is incorporeal consciousness ...

Anyway, there is no point discussing this, since if we will find out, it will only be at death.
Yes indeed.

Some few whose brains have been recorded as dead, come back with a rich description of a complex conscious reality but we will only know for certain ourselves when we die.
Well NDE is a whole field, but so far no-one has been actually dead, and re-animated. all that we know is 'death' is somewhat harder to determine than we once thought.
I never meant 'inner god' as something lesser. Merely that the path to communion did not lie with external things but rather the mind which is not regarded as outer by many.
Indeed I would say the mind can only take us so far ...
 

Aupmanyav

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There is no reason for anyone to believe those things if they don't want to. I wonder if your mispelling of Bible was accidental. 😅 I found that being infinite also meant being unconditional love.
So I am God. So are you and everyone else. Quantum science proved that everything is energy and matter is just an illusion. Basically what our ancient gurus have been saying re maya is now proven by science. .. I'll know more if my consciousness still exists after my physical death and I no longer have my 5 senses.

I find great peace in meditation and communing with my inner self.
It was a typo. I do not go for unconditional love.
I am surely not God. Yeah, what our rishis said thousands of years ago is coming true.
I do not believe in consciousness after death.
Meditation sure is a path to peace if someone is not searching for siddhis.
Meditation can give answers to one's questions, but many think 'no thought' gives them insights.
It is thinking that gives us insights.
 

Aupmanyav

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Well, all that the biological aspects of our brain can do it understand reality through the senses. .. When the senses die, there is no need for consciousness to die.
I never meant 'inner god' as something lesser. Merely that the path to communion did not lie with external things but rather the mind which is not regarded as outer by many.
We understand reality with analysis and not through senses. When brain dies, consciousness has no place to survive.
Yeah, we communicate with ourselves, like when alone in the hills or on the coast of a river or in a temple. That is where the vibrations come strong.
 

Vasu Devan

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Aupmanyav

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Vasu Devan

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Blind have all senses other than sight, so, they can also make up things depending on what they have heard, smelled, tasted, and realized through touch. Because of the absence of one sense, they may have more awareness than us. Remember Helen Keller.
Just because some deceive does not mean automatically that all do. The link I sent did have some examples of corroborated visual experiences. But, hell, in a reality where wealth is often espoused as a path to happiness, I realize that many researchers may misrepresent data in the hope of gaining future grants. Also, I realize that as a strong atheist, it may be currently impossible for you to accept the possibility of spiritual experiences as a valid explanation for certain events. In fact, based on the nature of most of your posts here, I would understand that even if you did have what many, like myself, define as spiritual experiences, you would define it as a temporary delusion of your brain. I was an agnostic atheist before my experiences made me start researching religion more deeply and it took extreme experiences to make the switch to the other side. Even then, my switch only fully accepted nondualism while just remaining open-minded about many other properties of religions.

I am certainly not here to define my POV as the only possible reality. I fully accept some other, even materially based, explanations of my spiritual experiences as potentially valid explanations. I try to avoid what many churches do by claiming their view to be the only valid view of God. Even many proponents of science may be doing this now with the practice of scientism which claims empirical data is the only form through which truth can arrive.

Since one needs to observe or experience events to know if they are 'real' the latter point is valid but many proponents of science automatically dismiss or even deny the reality of experiences that arrive through mediums that do not solely represent the physically empirical senses. Science may be searching for answers to the mysteries of life but is only looking in one half of the field. When one automatically denies the veracity of data presented by another because one does believe it though, one is limiting one's and perhaps even others' ability to learn more about the reality we all share. Still, I personally think most information most people have of even their physical reality is based on the belief of another, not personal experience. Each new generation is told by family, school, and society what is 'true'. Children are taught what the right behavior, action, and even belief is. If they trust the teachers, they do not test the statements to prove them through experience. It takes actual experience to deviate from what our cultures tell us is the truth. In fact, sometimes I wonder if change in belief is actually triggered only by the positivity or negativity of our emotional feelings during experiences that challenge our existing beliefs.
 
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Cino

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What is your def of goy? I just thought it meant not jewish?
In English bibles, "goyim" is usually translated as "the nations" (yes, meaning non-Jewish nations)
 
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