Past, Present, Beyond?

Discussion in 'Belief and Spirituality' started by KnowSelf, Nov 16, 2019.

  1. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Yes. The Catholic mass, the eucharistic and sacraments.
     
  2. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    @Thomas
    Typo. Not Luke 10

    Luke 18:9-14
    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+18:9-14&version=KJV

    And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:

    Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

    The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

    I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

    And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

    I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  3. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    Oh, the Anglican High Church service is almost indistinguishable, isn't it? Even Calvinists celebrate the Eucharist communally. Quakers gather to pray.

    There are group rituals in many faiths and traditions. In Judaism, I believe it takes ten adults to do a proper communal prayer (but I am not Jewish myself, so this could be inaccurate). Muslims have a tradition of communal, led prayer. I've participated in some esoteric groups' elaborate rituals. Some groups do more ad-lib ceremonies.

    Live musicians and their audiences also tend to get into a formalized, ritualized way of delivering and appreciating and participating in the performance.

    While all of this can be very profound, I don't think (returning to the OP) that they necessarily result in more ethical conduct of the group members, or that not participating in regular spiritual group activity somehow results in less ethical conduct.

    Strange thing, ethics and moral (not restricted to sexual morals) behavior. There seems to be this obvious link to spirituality, but upon closer inspection, it is very tenuous. I believe nowadays that this is the reason why morality/ethics always seems to be "tacked on" to the spiritual/religious/metaphysical teachings of a tradition. It does not automatically follow from the latter, and yet, it is an inseparable part of the spiritual path.
     
  4. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Correct except the important distinction that while to Anglicans the eucharistic is just a 'commemoration' -- to Catholics it is the actual presence of Christ. As he promised at the last supper.
    I think it is the first commandment to love God with all the heart and mind and soul, and love of others must come from it, including common morality -- not stealing, etc?

    The pure Taoist yoga of immortality is softened down by Confucius to become a sort of 'family religion'?

    https://catholicherald.co.uk/issues/february-17th-2017/a-worldwide-force-for-good/

    "Pope Francis has urged Catholic institutions always to put Christ front and centre, arguing that otherwise “we would end up a compassionate NGO” and that “what would happen would be like when children make sandcastles and then it all falls down”.

    Put another way, Catholic ethos and identity is crucial to the survival of Catholic social action."
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  5. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    Communal gathering ...

    I like dances of universal peace...chants from all religions, set to repetitive group circle dance.

    Rainbow gathering morning of silence om circle.

    Building temples for people to leave memories, memorials, thoughts and prayers and releasing them to the universe thru fire.
     
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  6. KnowSelf

    KnowSelf Well-Known Member

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    People I have access to are not to my knowledge broad thinkers. They seemingly rely on trickled down consumer friendly messages. There does not seem to be many opportunities for in depth discussions relating to spirituality, religion or the cosmos. People I know don't seem interested in matters of thought and reason. It's kind of lonely here.
     
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  7. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    It's possible to understand how this could be a problem. So -- what are you going to do about it?
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  8. KnowSelf

    KnowSelf Well-Known Member

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    One step is this forum.. It's hard to find like minds. My job takes up most of my days and when I am not working, I spend with my wife.. I listen to audio books for philosophical / spiritual understanding and awareness. However, I haven’t found a social gathering to stimulate and harvest thoughts of depth and meaning.
    I cannot think of more I can do?
     
  9. KnowSelf

    KnowSelf Well-Known Member

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    In a previous forum note, I thought everybody in some form or fashion worked toward the goal of intellect or spiritual higher consciousness, in my limited state of world consciousness I learned to be only one person who presumed all people were alike. I was wrong and now to my knowledge there is nobody in my yard to play with.
     
  10. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Ok. So I am alone. As I was born and as I will die. So what now?
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  11. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Nobody here. Just me?
     
  12. KnowSelf

    KnowSelf Well-Known Member

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    Alone sometimes yearning for intelligent conversation
     
  13. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Perhaps alone is all I get?
     
  14. Namaste Jesus

    Namaste Jesus Praise the Lord and Enjoy the Chai Moderator

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    Shoot, I find myself a party of one on most topics here. We all see the world through our own eyes. Makes us neither good nor bad, right nor wrong, just individuals fully capable of independent thought. Just as was intended from the beginning.

    Being at peace with your own thoughts and ideals is more important than having the validation of others. Accepting that not all will share our views and not letting that prevent us from respecting one another as individuals and lending a hand when the need arises.
     
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  15. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    But that is my point exactly. It does not follow just from belief in God that one should love others. The first commandment is a commandment, an ethical rule, which has to be explicitly stated alongside any articles or professions of faith, it does not follow from them.
     
  16. muhammad_isa

    muhammad_isa Save Our Souls

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    I don't understand.
    The 10 commandments are the foundation of faith.
    The whole faith is built on the 1st. commandment
    i.e. the Oneness of G-d

    ..without that, there would be no authority for the other 9 :)
     
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  17. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Well that was a very big issue for the Israelites. Only one God. No mistake about it!

    And although some ancient tribal customs were brutal by modern standards (something the haters love to concentrate on) in fact the laws of the Israelites were very advanced in terms of treatment of others, etc.

    Their feasts and rituals were, still are, a way of making sure they do not ever forget that all things come from God? The yarmulke is worn as a reminder of something above. Please correct my knowledge of Judaism if I'm wrong or out of line.

    But the point is that to someone who does not know God exists as a reality, it's all just hokum anyway. There's a gulf too wide to cross.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2019
  18. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    Could be so important ya post it on your door. Say it when you get up and before you go to bed, and every time you cross your threshold?
     
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  19. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

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    My wife left almost 20 years ago, my kids are now off creating their own life.

    Empty nester? Naw I choose in my old age to live among friends, join new tribes, rekindle relations with old tribes, find new discussions.
     
  20. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    But if the other commandments were not explicitly stated, given only faith in one god, would the other commandments be self-evident to a faithful person?
     
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