Namaste Omprem,
I was speaking for myself, not the world and certainly not for all Jews or Judaism.
In regards to what is and has been going on in Israel and Palestine there are many sides of the equations, many issues, and many atrocities on BOTH sides. Your one sided attack does not foment productive discussion.
Jews are not so closely related to the Palestinians that they were not prepared to murder, maim and exile hundreds of thousands of Palestinians (and still do) in order to acquire their land and assets.
Regardless of what the political status of Palestine was at the end of WWII, it was not a homeland for Jews. Jews, however, invaded it killing not only Palestinians but also British soldiers and UN representatives. The 'postwar settlement' as you put it was an invasion by Jews who exhibited the lowest depths of barbarity in their lust for Palestinian land and possessions. And all because they failed to understand that 'Israel', 'Zion' and 'the promised land' are not referring to physical real estate but to a state of consciousness, i.e. God Consciousness.
Dream
Well-Known Member
Yes, you actually do show no regard when you say "Regardless of what." My grandfathers fought in WWII, and its memory has not died. It is poor language to say that 'Jews invaded Palestine', since that does not reflect history at all. 'Invaders' refers to people who initiate wars -- not to people who defend. Israel certainly did not invade Palestine and just start slaughtering. If you want to argue that Israel is not telling us something about the current situation, then do so. This is your tenth post on the site. Time to prove you're not just a troll.Omprem said:
The only defending that was done was by the British attempting to stop the Zionist invasion and by the resident Palestinians fighting for their lives against the invading Jews. And yes, the invading Jews did exactly start slaughtering.
Oh, yes, your referral to my being a new member is a logical fallacy, namely argumentum ad hominem circumstantial. And while I may be new to you that does not mean that I am new to the topics I address. Forewarned is forearmed.
Does this mean that you condemn the zionist occupation of Palestine and its gross mistreatment of the Palestinians, the rightful owners of that land?
Does this mean that you acknowledge that a literal interpretation of "Zion", "Israel", and "the promised land" as Middle East real estate is in error and that those terms should be considered instead as referring to a state of God Consciousness?
The original attack was that of Zionists on the residents of Palestine. There are not many sides, many issues to the Palestinian invasion by Jews. There is only their greed for land. Surely you are aware that as early as 1898, the Zionists were plotting to take over a territory. The Zionists at one time considered Argentina and at another time considered the British offer of a country of their choosing in Africa (which, of course, the British did not have the right to offer), but settled on Palestine as they thought they could make a spurious historical claim on it based on misinterpreted Biblical references and on the fact that there were less than a million Palestinians living there at the time. Oh, yes, there were no atrocities on both sides on the invading Zionist side against which the Palestinians who were and are the rightful inhabitants of that land attempted to defend themselves as they still do.
Indeed, it was the UN that granted the Jews tracts of land in Palestine, for a "homeland" after the sufferings of the Holacost.
Read your secular history, particularly that of the resolutions enacted by the UN circa 1948, which stated that the Palestinians could come back to the "new" country of Israel, if they could do so peacefully. Never happened and hasn't happened since.
I suspect that Israel will never lose their country again. I also suspect that the Muslims of the area that will be eventually killed in order to remove Israel, will be done so by neighboring Islamic neighbors, and not Israel. It's happening now. Collateral damage for the cause of driving the Israelis into the sea...
Please take time to read Israeli nation history. It is only 65 years old. It hasn't had time to be corrupted by anyone, if you care to look and compare. The truth might just surprise you.
bananabrain
awkward squadnik
omprem,
positions like yours are part of the problem, not part of the solution. those of us who really want a workable solution have rejected such doctrinaire, one-sided positions. at the moment, you're basically taking the same position as mahmoud ahmedinejad. that at least ought to give you pause for thought.
b'shalom
bananabrain
positions like yours are part of the problem, not part of the solution. those of us who really want a workable solution have rejected such doctrinaire, one-sided positions. at the moment, you're basically taking the same position as mahmoud ahmedinejad. that at least ought to give you pause for thought.
b'shalom
bananabrain
After the Jews had murdered, maimed or deported hundreds of thousands of Palestinians, the rightful inhabitants and owner of Palestine.
In addition, Two wrongs do not make a right. The U.N. and the Jews do not have the right to give away/take someone else's land and assets. As you brought up the U.N., it is interesting to note that the U.N. also passed several dozen resolutions condemning the Jewish mistreatment of the Palestinians.
So you do not condemn the Jewish invasion of someone else's land, nor the the atrocities by Jews that accompanied that invasion. Nor are you able to move beyond a linear and literal (and self-justifying) interpretation of the Torah despite the many references through the Bible that literalism is a dead end detour and that one has to move beyond empiricism, logic, reason and sense impression in order to attain God Consciousness.
The 'problem' is the invasion and occupation by Jews of someone else's lands, water and assets. The solution is to get rid of the Jews from Palestine and make them atone for the suffering they have caused. What could be clearer?
Your 'workable solution' seems to consist of somehow allowing the Jewish occupation to keep its ill-gotten gains and not face war crimes trials or other means of atonement. You essentially want to have the Zionist cake and eat it too. Until your 'workable solution' restores dignity and assets to the Palestinians you are complicit in the occupation.
Jews spend an inordinate amount of time trying to recover assets taken from them by the Nazis, including even the assets they sold in a hurry at a discount but they make zero attempt to return assets stolen from the Palestinians or to make amends for the hundreds of thousands of deaths, maiming and exilings.
That 'workable solution' seems to be, in the minds of Zionists, something very similar to the 'final solution' of the Nazis. Palestinians are herding into containment areas and kept there awaiting death from disease, from Zionist shell fire and from hopelessness.
If immoral behaviour such as that exhibited by Zionists for over a century lifts your skirt, I feel sorry for you.
First, "Israel" is not a nation. It is an occupation seeking legitimacy.
Second, "Israel" is not even real estate. It is a metaphor for one of the higher states of God Consciousness but one that still has traces of dualism in it.
Third, the Zionist 'Israel' was founded on corruption, murder, mayhem, and manipulation. One of the more glaring examples of Zionist immorality and depravity was the April, 1948 attack by Jewish paramilitaries on the hillside town of Deir Yassin in which some 254 defenseless Palestinian men, women and children were murdered by the paramilitaries despite the town have concluded non-aggression pacts with neighbouring Jewish settlements. This attack carried out merely to acquire a strategic position of high vantage point.
This cowardly attack on Deir Yassin was part of official Zionist policy as can be seen from the 1940 comment of Joseff Weitz, one of the Zionist leaders and head of the Land Settlement Department, "The only solution is to transfer the Arabs from here to neighbouring countries. Not a single village or a single tribe must be let off." Unfortunately too many Palestinians were 'transferred' as cadavers.
Wrong. Israel has been real since 1948. In addition, it illegitimately occupies additional territory. Sorry to inject a little reality into blinkered partisan politics.
Wrong, again. Isreal is a chunk of real territory in western Palestine. Too bad I had to inject some geography into blinkered partisan politics.
As for the atrocities committed by militias, name a single nation that was not founded in blood.
There are reasons why Satan is referred to as "the lord of this world" (John 12:31).
None of the nations of this world are holy things, which is why we should at very most, grant only temporary allegiance to them.
Not if blind, hatemongering antisemites who cannot tell the difference between "Jew" and "militant Zionist" are the ones demanding it. I will not grant favor to one group of murderers merely because they think their grandpappies were wronged by another set of murderers.
I see that you are an apologist for Zionism. It is too bad that your literalism prevents you from understanding the Torah.
And it is too bad that you think it is okay to invade someone's lands and expel or kill the rightful inhabitants. Perhaps you would have a different view if someone decided that they wanted your home and killed your family to get it.
And it is too bad that you think it is okay to invade someone's lands and expel or kill the rightful inhabitants. Perhaps you would have a different view if someone decided that they wanted your home and killed your family to get it.
In the U.S. and Canada there is no statute of limitations on murder. Apparently there is none in the Middle East either.
Oh well we will just have to wait for Iran's nuclear bomb program to come to fruition. Then the times will be interesting indeed.
Have you noticed that your attempted insult of 'antisemite' is a bit hollow considering that Arabs are semites? Or, have you noticed how those who cannot defend their position, like you, resort to insult and denial in an infantile attempt to prop up and justify their hatred?