Can Gays be Cured?

[one of the few]

I don't believe there's a cure you can take but I do believe that God has a plan for all of us and who am I to question God's plan for some one else. I think we spend to much time worrying about others problems when we ignore our own problems I do know problems don't go away by ignoring them. So instead of asking is there a cure why not take a minute out of your busy day to ask God to place it on your heart what you can do to be in the presence of God and all other issues will be answered. may God bless all those that seek him and let God's healing power come to those who believe.

 

[one of the few]

Please excuse my joining in on your question, I have friends that are gay and find them to be some of the most honest and intelligent people I know. I regret when I was younger and acted in anger toward these people. I don't believe I have the right to challenge others faith in or belief of because of their sexual choices. I do have discretion and discerning of spirit and believe my only right is to pray for God to touch another's heart no more or less. I thank you again for the privilege to post my opinion.

 

[bob x]

u look like a... christian

Now THAT was completely uncalled-for

My problem is, I find it difficult to accept that ur sexuality, which u don't even seem to indulge in much physically is so pivotal to ur existence...

Infrequency of physical release just makes the emotions more intense.

most the of gay people I know are what I call "ultra-gay". They are not extremists, but everything, for them, is connected to being gay.

Actually, I bet that most of the gay people you know are people you would never suspect of being gay, and would not feel inclined to open up to you.

I do not think women are somehow naturally predisposed to bi-sexuality.

Not all, or even most. But bisexuality does appear to be much more common in females than in males.

I wanted to poke fun at you because I thought you were playing the wounded drama-queen

Well, I AM a drama-queen, often. There's a reason they're called drama "queens" Hyper-emotionality is often part of the same package with homosexuality, I don't know why, but it seems to be. There's a reason bullies find us a favored target.

As choices go, I am most "turned on" by the idea of shagging panthers. My main problem in indulging my beastial fantasies is the issue of consent, and so I remain a virgin, so to speak. Recently I have discovered that there are people who, because of a genetic mutation, are completely covered in hair. They call them wolf-people. I want one, and am prepared to travel.

Feel free to openly deride me about this, of course.

I wouldn't think of doing so. I would even help you find a furry, if I knew one.

As far as the photo goes here was my first thoughts on who was who:
I thought Q was Greymare's husband.

As well you should. Their genuine affection for each other was quite evident all evening. Truth to tell, when the idea of a get-together was first broached in private messages, I was somewhat apprehensive about meeting Q (we hadn't gotten along well on the boards up until then); it was because Greymare obviously liked him that I decided to set any such prejudices aside-- and as you can see in the picture, the result was that a great time was had by all.

 

[greymare]

why thank you bob. lol. i didnt realise i had such influence. lol

 

[bob x]

It appeared that you knew him better than I did, so I should defer to your judgment.

 

[Muslimwoman]

You say that you "choose your sexuality". But how do you know that others are not more compelled in that area ? Also, if "we just don't know", then why would you want to judge and criticise someone else's orientation ? Especially knowing that this group has been harassed and discriminated against widely ? Haven't you been subject to these acts as a minority (certainly women have been treated as a minority) ? As a Jew, I have been treated this way and I can identify with these issues, that is why I am very supportive of minority groups, whether they are self-selected or not.

As I have said I don't know what compels someone to be homosexual, I don't even know if they are compelled, I only have my own life experiences to form my opinions on.

I don't judge a person by their sexuality, skin colour or religion but in the same way I tell my Christian friends they are worshipping idols, I tell my gay friends they have made a wrong sexual choice and they come right back at me with my odd choice of religious dress and my dreadful smoking habits.

No you don't. You believe that I ought to be with a woman rather than a man based strictly on my body parts, regardless of my soul.

No, this is where you are completely misunderstanding me ... I believe your body parts are designed to fit with a womans body parts, if that's not what you want to do with them that's your choice but the fact remains they are physically designed to fit with a womans and no amount of demanding acceptance is ever going to change that.

I would never suggest you be with a woman if that is not for you, I wouldn't want anyone to live a lie.

I ask for understanding, which you refuse to give me. I never asked for your advice, which you insist on giving.

Oh pish .... what you ask for is acceptance, you want everyone to validate your sexuality and say it's natural.

I haven't offered any advice at all, just my opinion and I will repeat, if you don't want an intimate part of your life discussed on an open public forum then don't discuss it.

You are bisexual, and that is not something that you choose about yourself, although it your choice which direction of attraction you pursue (or both, or neither). I am not.

I used to have one moto in life ... never knock it til you've tried it .... after 30 seconds I left the room with the absolute certainty I would never try it again .. I call that a choice and I don't call it bisexual. Fantasy is one thing, reality is quite another.

Of course you do not have to believe others when they tell you they are not like you. But don't pretend there is nothing offensive about calling people liars.

Repeating myself is getting boring Bobx ... I said we do not know what "causes" (can't think of a more appropriate word that won't hurt your feelings) homosexuality ..... so how the bleedin hell is that calling you a lair.

Look Bobx .. you're gay, I don't care.

I personally believe at some stage in your life you made a choice and I believe it was a wrong choice ... I may be totally wrong, won't be the first time and won't be the last but it's my opinion.

So get over yourself and stop caring so much what other people think about you ... oh and stop telling people on the net you are gay if it hurts you to be told not everyone wants to go on a gay pride march with you ... everyone will never agree with everything anyone does.

 

[bob x]

As I have said I don't know what compels someone to be homosexual, I don't even know if they are compelled, I only have my own life experiences to form my opinions on.

You could also learn from the experiences of others, if you were willing to believe them.

I don't judge a person by their sexuality, skin colour or religion but in the same way I tell my Christian friends they are worshipping idols, I tell my gay friends they have made a wrong sexual choice and they come right back at me with my odd choice of religious dress and my dreadful smoking habits.

That is what the word "judge" MEANS. You are a thoroughly and unpleasantly judgmental person. I can be judgmental too, certainly; but I don't make this bogus that I am "not" judging, when I am.

Oh pish .... what you ask for is acceptance, you want everyone to validate your sexuality and say it's natural.

It IS my nature. Are you capable of understanding that?

I haven't offered any advice at all, just my opinion

An "opinion" about what is right or wrong for someone else is what the word "advice" means.

and I will repeat, if you don't want an intimate part of your life discussed on an open public forum then don't discuss it.

Of course I expect discussion, and I am never surprised that much of the discussion from religious people consists of nasty judgments and arrogant advice. My part of the discussion often consists of telling the religious people that they are being nasty and arrogant: if you don't want your religious attitudes discussed, then don't discuss them.

I used to have one moto in life ... never knock it til you've tried it .... after 30 seconds I left the room with the absolute certainty I would never try it again .. I call that a choice and I don't call it bisexual. Fantasy is one thing, reality is quite another.

This is quite different from the impression that I got, namely that you had tried it and HAD felt the divine release and the binding of the heart, and continued to feel such attractions-- but had decided not to pursue it.
No, I do not call what happened to you "choice": could you have CHOSEN to make that encounter work for you? I say you could not, that it is simply not in your nature.
Now, understand that I also have tried sex with a woman, and likewise it did not work for me at all. In that respect, we are alike.

Repeating myself is getting boring Bobx ... I said we do not know what "causes" (can't think of a more appropriate word that won't hurt your feelings) homosexuality ..... so how the bleedin hell is that calling you a lair.

I DO know what DOESN'T cause it: namely, any choice on my part. You cannot know what is or isn't inside my head, but I do know, and I have told you what I know. Although you don't know whether I am telling you truth or not, you could believe me. Instead:

I personally believe at some stage in your life you made a choice

This is directly calling me a liar.

and I believe it was a wrong choice ...

And this is what is meant by judging. Even though we may from time to time be able to speak in a friendly manner, you are my enemy, and evidently will never be anything but an enemy.

 

[Tao_Equus]

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[Muslimwoman]

You could also learn from the experiences of others, if you were willing to believe them.

I can listen to a starving child in Africa all day, I can sympathise, I can try to help, I can believe they are starving and feel bitter toward the rich west BUT I can never know what that child feels or experiences.

That is what the word "judge" MEANS. You are a thoroughly and unpleasantly judgmental person. I can be judgmental too, certainly; but I don't make this bogus that I am "not" judging, when I am.

No, you see if I was judging you I would decide you are a bad person because in my mind you do a bad thing sexually ... that's judging a person and as I have not said you are a bad person I don't feel I am judging you based purely on your sexuality.

It IS my nature. Are you capable of understanding that?

Without being homosexual and believing it to be an un-natural act ... no not really.

An "opinion" about what is right or wrong for someone else is what the word "advice" means.

Gosh the second time someone has tried to teach me the English language on this thread how thrilling.

Advice = Opinion about what could or should be done about a situation or problem; counsel.

I have not told you what I think you should do and I have not given you counsel, therefore I have offered no advice, just opinion.

Opinion = A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof:

Of course I expect discussion, and I am never surprised that much of the discussion from religious people consists of nasty judgments and arrogant advice.

So if you know what to expect and still come to such forums to discuss your sexuality then you shouldn't play the drama queen and say how hurt you feel by the comments.

This is quite different from the impression that I got,

No it is the impression you WANTED to get ... I talked about sexual fantasies .. you then turned that into reality.

Even though we may from time to time be able to speak in a friendly manner, you are my enemy, and evidently will never be anything but an enemy.

Do you know what disturbs me about you calling me "an enemy" Bobx, you sound as closed minded as the radical Islamists or George Bush when he was trying to make a case for war.

However, that is entirely your choice and I doubt I shall lose much sleep over it.

 

[citizenzen]

bob x — It IS my nature. Are you capable of understanding that?

Muslimwoman — Without being homosexual and believing it to be an un-natural act ... no not really.

MW, it's still a belief held by a number of men in America that a woman would not make a good leader because her menstrual cycle causes her to become crazy once a month.

Now, I don't have to be a woman to know that you're as capable as a man when it comes to running affairs of the state.

Are you so callous that you're truly incapable of empathizing with what bob x is talking about? I'd like to think you were wiser than you let on.

 

[Muslimwoman]

Now, I don't have to be a woman to know that you're as capable as a man when it comes to running affairs of the state.

I don't agree with you. Some women are capable of it but many of us are way too emotional to hold such an office and yes some do turn into the bitch from hell once a month. It's simple biology.

It's like the forces argument, I have served in the armed forces but do not believe women should be allowed on the front line or to fly fighter jets. Very few of us are emotionally detatched enough for front line fighting (the effects are lasting) and we bring men up to protect women, then demand the right to be gang raped in enemy prisons while male servicemen listen on and are told they will stop when they tell all.

So I would suggest you do have to be a woman to understand the emotions we feel and the raging hormones once month and it's time we all accept men and women ARE different ... equal but different.

Are you so callous that you're truly incapable of empathizing with what bob x is talking about? I'd like to think you were wiser than you let on.

What is callous about saying I do not understand homosexuality?

 

[citizenzen]

Since I'm white, I am incapable of understanding why minorities complain about discrimination.

Since I'm a home owner, I am incapable of understanding the plight of the homeless.

Since I'm a man, I am incapable of understanding why women hesitate to walk alone at night.

Since I have a job, I am incapable of understanding the how people could be unemployed.

Since I am healthy, I am incapable of relating to the sick, handicapped and infirm.

These are the excuses that I could come up with if I felt so inclined. But what kind of person would I be?

 

[Muslimwoman]

These are the excuses that I could come up with if I felt so inclined. But what kind of person would I be?

I have tried to limit my discussion to my opinion about biological sexual acts, a penis does not belong in another man and I will never understand why people try to push square pegs into round holes (pun intended), if that makes me callous then I am callous.

 

[citizenzen]

I have tried to limit my discussion to my opinion about biological sexual acts...

And I have tried to expand your limited discourse through use of analogies, a tool used commonly in both debate and scripture.

I see that I've failed in my efforts.

I will leave you with this definition from merriam-webster.com.

callous
cal·lous
Pronunciation:
\ˈka-ləs\
Function:
adjective
Etymology:
Middle English, from Latin callosus, from callum, callus callous skin
Date:
15th century
1 a: being hardened and thickened b: having calluses <callous hands>
2 a: feeling no emotion b: feeling or showing no sympathy for others : hard-hearted
— cal·lous·ly adverb
— cal·lous·ness noun

 

[Muslimwoman]

I see that I've failed in my efforts.

2 a: feeling no emotion b: feeling or showing no sympathy for others : hard-hearted

Why on earth should I feel any emotion about a sexual act I believe is un-natural?

Let's take another example ... swingers. I don't approve of swinging, yet it is also consensual between adults. Perhaps you want me to consider the feelings of swingers and how offended they might be if I express my revulsion for their chosen sexual habits?

 

[citizenzen]

Perhaps you want me to consider the feelings of swingers and how offended they might be if I express my revulsion for their chosen sexual habits?

I do believe that swingers can be married and enjoy all the civil rights currently being denied gay couples.

Just as with anybody's religious belief, I don't care what you choose to believe personally. I only care when the belief unduly influences secular, civil law... or when that belief is put forth in a forum discussion, where you are inviting others to comment on it.

If you want your private feelings to be free from any examination or criticism then you're probably better off not exposing them in a forum intended just for that purpose.

 

[Muslimwoman]

I do believe that swingers can be married and enjoy all the civil rights currently being denied gay couples.

and I believe adulterers should be flogged in the town square, so we probably won't get any further with that conversation.

I only care when the belief unduly influences secular, civil law... or when that belief is put forth in a forum discussion, where you are inviting others to comment on it.

So you believe that yours is the only view that counts or should be expressed.

If a vast majority of people in a country follow one religion and that religion states something is wrong, therefore a majority of people believe it, then why should the majority be forced to accept a minority view?

If you want your private feelings to be free from any examination or criticism then you're probably better off not exposing them in a forum intended just for that purpose.

Oh examine away, I don't express any views here that I wouldn't express face to face ... of course what you mean is it would be better, in your opinion, if I kept my opinions to myself .... this IS a religious forum, I am free to express my religious beliefs here and of course you are free to "examine" them.

 

[iBrian]

If a vast majority of people in a country follow one religion and that religion states something is wrong, therefore a majority of people believe it, then why should the majority be forced to accept a minority view?

I'm actually surprised no one has brought the issue of slavery and black rights up for comparison, considering the discussion at hand is yet another on the topic of minority rights.

 

[Muslimwoman]

I'm actually surprised no one has brought the issue of slavery and black rights up for comparison, considering the discussion at hand is yet another on the topic of minority rights.

That's a very good point Brian, I would never like to see another apartheid again.

I'll vote for gays to have the right to get married but I'm never going to accept that homosexual sex is physically natural and no amount of political correctness will change my mind.

 

[Quahom1]

I'm actually surprised no one has brought the issue of slavery and black rights up for comparison, considering the discussion at hand is yet another on the topic of minority rights.

Due in great part to the fact that a black person can not help the color of skin, all other things being equal and normal to any other human being. That is a blemish of shame that many have a hard time coming to grips with.

The majority of society on the other hand, consider sexual preference, just that, a preference, and private, and therefore not subject to special status. It is not an obvious trait that most consider ingrained, but rather, chosen. It is akin to my stating that because I am Catholic, I deserve special consideration, above and beyond that which the rest of society has. The fact is, that just because I choose to continue to be Catholic grants me no special rights within society. My arguing that it is in my blood and has been in my family for generations, and I should be considered "special" in the eyes of society because of my affiliation, or choices, really holds no water.

Society considers homosexuality in the same light, and therefore is reluctant to open that pandora's box, to every other sexual or religious or political preference, people profess.

And there is a physiological issue to homosexuality that society in general holds on to. It serves no purpose in and of itself, to better society as a whole. Psychologically, it is considered, selfish, and detracts from the collective good of society at large.

At the basest level of humanity, the majority find homosexuality, disgusting.

Tolerance, and acceptance...are two different animals.